As measles resurfaces, how concerned should New Hampshire be?

The World Health Organization once declared measles eradicated in the United States, but lately the disease has made a resurgence. The latest outbreak is in West Texas and New Mexico — so far, there are over 300 reported cases and two deaths, though experts fear many other cases haven’t been reported. What’s going on? Should we be worried in New Hampshire? On this episode of “The State We’re In,” Melanie Plenda discusses talks with Dr. Gabriela Andujar Vazquez, hospital epidemiologist at Dartmouth Health’s Dartmouth-Hitchcock Medical Center.

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

Melanie Plenda:

Doctor, why are we seeing a resurgence in measles cases?

Dr. Gabriela Andujar Vazquez:

Even before the COVID-19 pandemic, we had started seeing, nationally, a decrease in our vaccination rates, and mainly childhood vaccinations. During the pandemic, that worsened and the rates nationally started decreasing below the 95% threshold where we like to see vaccination rates to be in order to create herd immunity so the community is protected. What we're seeing with measles — which is among one of the vaccine-preventable diseases — is that it mainly is being driven by those declining rates of vaccination.

Melanie Plenda:

What does measles look like? What are the symptoms, and when should you seek medical help?

Dr. Gabriela Andujar Vazquez:

Measles starts with a high, high fever. The struggle is that this particular virus mimics, or is similar to, other childhood illnesses — a fever and rash. Parents experience that a lot. But, it will start with a very high fever, usually up to 105 Fahrenheit, and then four to five days after, you can break into a rash. Usually it starts in the face, and then it spreads through the whole body. People get a cough, runny nose and the eyes become a little bit red.

Call your pediatrician when they're having that high fever because there are severe complications. There are health implications, especially for children, when they get measles.

Melanie Plenda:

Why is what’s happening in Texas and New Mexico concerning? 

Dr. Gabriela Andujar Vazquez:

The outbreak is not controlled yet. We have pockets right in the United States where the rates of vaccination may be lower than the national levels. In West Texas, the particular community where the outbreak started, vaccination rates for children were in the low 80s. The outbreak that's happening in New Mexico is a consequence of the West Texas outbreak. There was a pocket of a community there that was also vulnerable, because their vaccination rates were low. 

Melanie Plenda:

What’s the likelihood of this outbreak or others spreading? 

Dr. Gabriela Andujar Vazquez:

We know that within New Hampshire and Vermont, there are areas where vaccination rates overall are lower than what we want them to be to protect the community. Every state, I think, has been struggling with this. I think in New Hampshire, we are likely to see cases in the future. Hopefully, those come in a cluster, and we can contain them quickly and it doesn’t spread, but we are definitely vulnerable for identifying or getting outbreaks here as well.

Melanie Plenda:

What would happen if the measles spread to New Hampshire? Is the state prepared?

Dr. Gabriela Andujar Vazquez:

In 2024, there was a measles case identified in the summer, and that was actually pretty well contained, with the collaboration between Dartmouth Health and the Department Health and Human Services in New Hampshire. I think every state, including New Hampshire, is prepared to contain an outbreak. 

I would say that once we identify those cases, the key thing for the community to know is if you're sick and you think you may have measles is to wear a mask. That helps contain the spread. It produces source control, so we don't infect others while we're sick, and figuring out if we actually have measles.

Vaccination is the other key — making sure that we're up to date on that too, and if we don’t know to ask questions to your doctors. “Am I really protected? Should I be getting another dose of a vaccine?” So I think those conversations need to happen amongst us to protect our community and those most vulnerable — people that will not be able to get vaccinated.

Melanie Plenda:

Tell us about New Hampshire’s vaccination rates for measles. Is it high enough? 

Dr. Gabriela Andujar Vazquez:

Unfortunately, it’s not. Based on data from the 2023-24 school year . across all vaccines that are recommended for children going into kindergarten we're around 89% — so we're 5% below of what we would ideally want. That's across the state of New Hampshire. There's probably areas where that may vary, where maybe some vaccination rates are higher and some are lower, and that may vary also based on vaccine.

Melanie Plenda:

How safe is the vaccine? Should any certain area of the population be more concerned or be taking more steps for safety?

Dr. Gabriela Andujar Vazquez:

The vaccine was introduced in 1963 — the vaccine that we actually give now was revamped in 1972. Individuals who were born before 1957 were in a state where they were either probably had measles and are thought to be immune because of natural illness because there were multiple measles outbreaks constantly. Usually, if you're born before that date, you should be good — you should be protected.

When you're born between 1963 and 1967, there was a measles vaccine, but that vaccine was later found to not be as effective as the one that we give now.because it was a killed virus vaccine, not like the live attenuated vaccine of today, which is a little bit more effective in producing immunity.  So individuals born between 1963 and 1967 are recommended to get at least one dose of the current vaccine.

After that, if you’ve got your two doses of your childhood vaccination of MMR, you should be protected. There are obviously different conversations that can happen based on your individual risk — medical conditions or things that change over time, and I would encourage those patients to talk to their doctor about. But overall, we can confidently say that if you got your two doses, you're protected for life.

Melanie Plenda:

Does the vaccination prevent you from getting the virus?

Dr. Gabriela Andujar Vazquez:

Yes, absolutely. One  dose is 93% effective, and a second dose is 97%. What that means is that your individual risk of contracting measles is reduced by 97% if you get exposed to measles.

Melanie Plenda:

What about the cost of the measles vaccine? 

Dr. Gabriela Andujar Vazquez:

In the United States, each state has a vaccination program. In New Hampshire, we have a vaccination program basically called New Hampshire Vaccine Group. What that group does is purchase, basically, vaccines that are recommended for children, and they provide the vaccine to all children at no cost, regardless of whether they have insurance or not, whether they are able to pay or not. So for children, it is completely free, right off the bat, in basically all of the states in the United States. For adults, it is covered, but usually through insurance.

Melanie Plenda:

Are there other outbreaks or causes of concern that you are watching right now? 

Dr. Gabriela Andujar Vazquez:

Right now, measles has been taking up a lot of the past couple of weeks, because it's been ongoing, and we're worried that it's still probably a lot of work to be done. There's also been a lot of talk around avian flu and the concerns around how much or how little that may affect human transmission. So far, a lot of the cases across the country have been related to occupation — individuals who work with poultry or cattle and get exposed to a sick animal.

But we have had avian influenza in our flocks for many years. It's not like it's new, but I think we're seeing that it's mutating in a way that it's affecting maybe more of the animals than it used to. 

Another thing that comes and goes every five years is norovirus — a virus that causes gastrointestinal problems, like vomiting and diarrhea. It actually starts around spring to pick up, and it seems like it's going to be something that we need to watch for.

Melanie Plenda:

What’s your advice for those who are concerned about this or other outbreaks?

Dr. Gabriela Andujar Vazquez:

It’s basically just asking questions – keeping ourselves informed and having good resources for reliable information. We want to make sure that people are well informed, but with evidence and not necessarily things that may not have not been proven and alarm people unnecessarily. Having conversations personally with your healthcare provider should be a trusted source, then just talking about concerns and sort of fielding those questions to the appropriate experts.

Melanie Plenda:

Dr. Gabriela Andujar Vazquez, hospital epidemiologist at Dartmouth Health’s Dartmouth Hitchcock Medical Center, thank you for joining us today.

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communication at Franklin Pierce University. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members.

These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visit collaborativenh.org.

In a nation built by Immigrants, why is it so hard to be one?

Immigration was a hot-button issue in the last national election, and since President Donald Trump took office, it’s become even more prominent. Headlines regularly discuss raids by Immigration and Customs Enforcement, or ICE, rounding up undocumented immigrants. Tens of thousands have been arrested in the last few weeks and await deportation. Meanwhile, sanctuary cities have come under attack and face the threat of the federal government withholding promised funding. What does this all mean for New Hampshire residents? Here to discuss that is Eva Castillo, director of the N.H. Alliance for Immigrants and Refugees, or Welcoming New Hampshire. 

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

Melanie Plenda:

Eva, please tell us about your work with immigrants and refugees. How long has it been going on, and how did you get involved? 

Eva Castillo: 

I got involved in the late 70s, when I first moved to the U.S. as a student, and then I realized the different treatment that we got from just regular people. I wasn't even planning on immigrating here, but this is all I've ever done since the ‘70s, and I became a resident in the ‘80s.

I worked at the now defunct Latin American Center in the ‘80s, and I noticed that concentrating on services is not going to make any difference, like putting a Band-Aid on a gangrene-infected wound. So I started doing advocacy and policy, and in 2007 I was hired by the Massachusetts Immigrant and Refugee Advocacy Coalition. They created this program, the New Hampshire Alliance for Immigrants and Refugees, because there were nobody — and still, to this day, there's nobody — whose only job is to advocate for immigrants. We have social justice organizations, and they can pick and choose immigration as one of their issues, but I only do immigration.

Melanie Plenda:

What is the work you do at the New Hampshire Alliance for Immigrants and Refugees? 

Eva Castillo:

Right now, we're working on legislation, but we build community and we build positive relationships that make things easier for immigrants and refugees to integrate into society. We do leadership training with community organizing, tons of advocacy and just building relationships.

Melanie Plenda:

When we talk about immigrants, we often use terms like “documented” and “undocumented.’ For our audience, can you explain what those terms mean? 

Eva Castillo:

Documented immigrants are people that are here legally. They can be students, they can be tourists, they can be people with work visas. They can be naturalized citizens or legal permanent residents. Undocumented people are those people that just came through the borders without inspection, or a very common occurrence is the people that came here on some type of visa and overstayed. It’s very common for students, for example, to overstay their visas, and also for tourists.

Melanie Plenda:

During the last presidential election, immigration was a hot topic. How did that impact the local community? 

Eva Castillo:

Well, it really became frustrating because both parties use immigration as a punching bag to divert attention from the stuff that really matters to the regular public, even here locally.

I don't see why our local candidates have to run on anti-immigrant platforms. I have been asking people, “Is immigration such a problem for you?” And everybody says they care about housing and about jobs or they want a place that provides drug rehab. Immigration is not on their radar, so we are diverting the attention from the things that really matter to your average New Hampshire person and spending money that should go to more positive things.

The fact that they refer to us as criminals and drug dealers — that doesn’t do a service to anybody, because most of the people that are here are just regular, good people that are here just trying to give their families a better chance, and they're contributing as members of our society. 

It is a fact that undocumented immigrants commit way less crimes than anybody. When you hear every time that an immigrant commits a crime or does something wrong, then it gets blown up in the newspapers, in the media. But I never heard anybody saying a French Canadian or an Irishman did this, and that gives a bad impression to the rest of the residents of the state, and that puts targets on our backs because we're all judged by the very few people that are, that are doing the wrong thing.

Melanie Plenda:

What are some of the concerns out there, when the rhetoric heats up like this?

Eva Castillo:

That someday they are going to get violence with us. In fact, I was just left a nasty message on my phone the other day by an anonymous caller. At least I have the guts and the integrity to put my name behind my words. Some just call me names and tell me, “I hope you get deported, I hope you die.” This is not the first time, and it won't be the last time, but it is just a matter of time before somebody really takes it upon themselves to hurt one of us, because we do not walk around with our passport tattooed on our forehead. 

So, if you sound like me, or if you look like the stereotype of the immigrant — which is, by the way, not a white person — then you're in danger. I have calls from parents of U.S. citizens that are brown teenagers, and they say, how can my kid prove that he's a citizen? How do I protect my child? It is so painful, and at the same time it is upsetting that a mother has to worry about proving and doing something to prove that their kids have the right to live in this country when they've been born here.

Melanie Plenda:

I know it’s hard to generalize, but since President Trump took office, what’s been going on in the local immigrant and refugee community? How are they feeling? How do they feel treated?

Eva Castillo:

Again, we have seen an uptick in just nastiness towards us, and people are afraid. They are not going to the places that they used to go to. They try not to go out shopping too much. Some parents don't even want to send their children to school. The small businesses are being affected also, because their clients, their customers, don't show up.

I was talking to one of my friends who has a bodega. She said that at the end of the day, I have to throw half the food away because nobody no one comes. Another friend of mine has a barber shop, and she says that she is going to have to close her barber shop that she had for 20 years because people don't come. 

So we're affecting people that are here legally, that are U.S. citizens. We're affecting everybody. It's not only the people that live in fear. And then the kids — they don't deserve to live in fear. They don't deserve to have this stress on them. It's affecting their mental health and their well being too.

Melanie Plenda:

You mentioned the fear, what are people doing to cope?

Eva Castillo:

I go around, and I teach people their rights. I talk to them and tell them not to fear and to trust that somehow things are going to get better someday. But even myself, I spent many nights just going to bed crying because there's not much I can do. I feel totally powerless.

These are people that I have known for 20 years or more, that I know are good people. I'm not around protecting criminals. This is my community too, so I don't want criminals regardless of where they come from. I don't want them living in my community. Every time they pick somebody that's a good person that I know that is just trying to do the right thing, and there's just no way for them to make it right in the way this dysfunctional system works, it really hurts me. So I cannot imagine if I am like this, how hard it is for those people that are families of mixed status. We have tons of mixed-status families living under one roof, so everybody's affected.

Melanie Plenda:

What is the alliance doing about all this? 

Eva Castillo:

Well, I just give my support to people when they call me. Every weekend I go someplace, or every night I go someplace to give a “Know Your Rights” program. We have groups of people trying to provide support to the families that are left behind. There's another group of people that’s trying to find ICE activity, to verify that it is there instead of just spreading false news. That just increases the paranoia and the fear. We have groups of people just trying to talk to legislators locally to see if we can at least mitigate some of the harm or get people to understand that this is not the way. We really need to pass some type of reform that cleans up the old system and starts from scratch to make things easier. And we need to do something about the millions of people that are already here.

Melanie Plenda:

What other ideas do you have for solving this issue?

Eva Castillo:

We need our congresspeople to really grow some spine and do the right thing and stop using us — and I'm talking about both parties. Stop playing ping pong with the lives of immigrants, with the lives of people, and just revamp and pass some type of law that really solves this issue once and for all.

I have spent at least 25 years, if not more, begging our legislators on both sides. Please do something. We need to restate the fact that we're not talking about numbers here. We're talking about people, and we have really defaced immigrants. We have really dehumanized them to the point that people don't even have any compassion, or they don't feel anything because it's all about numbers. We're talking about families — mothers, children, fathers, elderly. Let's put humanity back in immigration.

Melanie Plenda:

Thank you so much for sharing these insights. Eva Castillo, director of the New Hampshire Alliance for Immigrants and Refugees, thank you for joining us today.

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communication at Franklin Pierce University. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visit collaborativenh.org.

How to participate and take action in your local government

Last week we delved into what town meetings are about, alongside their role in local journalism. This week we continue to explore the intricacies of annual town meetings and town meeting elections. How can you get involved? Where can you get information? On this episode of “The State We’re In,” New Hampshire Secretary of State David Scanlan helps us find out how the average person can participate and take decisive action in their local community. 

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

Melanie Plenda:

First, let's take a step back. For our audience who may be unfamiliar with them, how did town meetings begin? How have they changed and evolved?

David Scanlan:

Well, town meeting is rooted from our colonial past, and when the settlers came over to this continent and they started to congregate and form townships and communities, there had to be a way for the people in those communities to make decisions about how they were going to handle the affairs of the community. That's basically how town meetings got started. It became a formal process because there had to be some ground rules on how meetings would take place. 

Melanie Plenda:

Do some New Hampshire towns still have a traditional annual town meeting?

David Scanlan:

Yes, many still have this, mostly the smaller towns, but even some of the larger ones still have a traditional town meeting, and the format is basically the same as it was 300 years ago. I've attended many of those deliberative types of meetings, and they're fascinating. It's great entertainment, if nothing else. But effectively it brings the community together, allows them to discuss important issues to the community and come to a resolution on them. 

Melanie Plenda:

What is the secretary of state’s role in town meetings across New Hampshire? 

David Scanlan:

Well, town meetings are just that. They're there for the local communities and political subdivisions in New Hampshire. The secretary of state really does not have a role in that process, other than there are state statutes that apply to elections generally.

The participants in any election are maintained on the statewide voter registration database. Then there are laws on the books related to electioneering and campaigning and things similar that we're kind of responsible for. The important thing is we act as a resource to the towns on the best way to conduct their elections. What the different roles are of election officials — the moderator, the clerk, supervisors of the checklist — and we're there primarily for support.

Melanie Plenda:

What do residents need to vote? Can they still register?

David Scanlan:

The town meeting is actually in two parts. There is the voting part for officers. The town election is an election. To vote and participate in that election, a person must be on the voter checklist, and towns also have election day registration, so somebody in town who wants to participate that is not registered can do that on the day of the town election.

The requirements have become a little more strict for registration. A voter has to prove four things: identity, age, citizenship and domicile. And when a voter registers, they have to bring documentation that proves each of those qualifications. There's a list on the secretary of state website if voters want to see that. 

The other part of town meeting, then, is the deliberative part, and that is where the voters outside of the election process come together physically in a group. They will take up the articles that are placed on the town warrant. So prior to the deliberative session, there's an opportunity for the selectmen — the governing body of the town — to present the articles that they want to have discussed, like the town budget and other important things. Then there's an opportunity for petition warrant articles, which can be any topic that the members of the community want to discuss. And then that is publicized in advance of the meeting. Only those articles on the warrant can be discussed and acted on at the meeting, and the moderators are responsible for taking those up, one by one — having a debate, making any amendments, voting them up or down, and then moving on to the next article.

Melanie Plenda:

How can a citizen looking to get involved with their local community access information about the annual town meeting and the town election? 

David Scanlan:

In close proximity to the meeting itself, obtain a copy of the town warrant, which is published in a form that is called the annual report. There's a lot of really useful information in there — a lot of it maybe not so useful, but really, really interesting facts about the town. It will have the budget published, so you can see where the town plans to spend money over the next year. All of the articles that are going to be taken up at town meeting will be on the warrant, and many of them publish statistics of how many births there were, how many deaths.There might be ceremonial recognitions for people who have made major contributions to the town. It’s a pretty fascinating document. 

Towns have great participation from the citizens of the town, and it is easy to participate by getting elected to the planning board, the conservation commission, the budget committee, or the cemetery agent. There are many, many elected positions in town government that may interest people, and it is very interesting to serve on those. I've served in many committees at the local level myself, and it's a very, very rewarding experience. It gives you a better understanding of how the town handles its affairs, and you get to meet the other great people that live in your community. 

Melanie Plenda:

Can you tell us a little bit more about what deliberative sessions are and how they relate to town meeting elections, and if someone is able to attend the deliberative session can they still vote?

David Scanlan:

Well, every town meeting has some form of a deliberative component.

In a traditional town meeting, the people that want to participate and vote on the issues show up at the town hall or school gymnasium — wherever the meeting is going to be held. And then it is an opportunity for the voters in that town to express their positions, feelings and concerns about any one of the topics that are going to come up in the form of an article at that meeting. In a traditional town meeting, after the discussion is over and any amendments are made, there is a final vote that's up or down and it becomes the position of the town if they’re passed. If they don’t pass, people can try again the following year. 

In a Senate Bill 2 town, or an official ballot voting town, there is a deliberative session where voters come together again in a single location, and they discuss the issues. They maybe offer amendments, but then when the discussion is finished there is not a final vote taken at that point in time. Instead, the article in its final form is actually placed on the official ballot, on the paper ballot that will be distributed on the day of the election, when the officers of the town are elected. And then the people will get to vote in the voting booth on each one of the articles that was presented. That gives an opportunity for more people to actually participate in the actual final vote of the town because people can show up at the polling place at their convenience during the polling hours and vote on those issues, as opposed to having to set aside two or three hours on a Tuesday night or a Saturday afternoon to attend the town meeting. 

There is no opportunity, really, for remote participation in the deliberative part of town meetings. Part of that is because those articles can be amended, and you really can't vote by absentee, or whatever, on items that might change before the final vote is taken. So at the moment, people have to be physically present at the deliberative session to participate. Now, with the increase in technology, there are probably opportunities that exist now for people to view the actual deliberative session in real time, but there are no opportunities presently that exist that allow people to actually vote remotely on the articles that are being presented.

Melanie Plenda:

What about you? Does your town have an annual town meeting or town meeting election and will you be participating? 

David Scanlan:

My town has a traditional town meeting, both for town and school district affairs, and I do participate in those. They're fascinating to me. It's a study on human nature. It's great to see people that maybe are timid and shy that feel so strongly about an issue that they build the courage to get up and speak — and that's important, and it's important that people feel that they can express their views without intimidation and pressure. And it's the moderator’s job to make sure that the discussion during a deliberative session is controlled to the point that there's no heckling and clapping, and things like that

There can be a lot of drama, and there can be a lot of humor too. I've seen some moderators in the past that have a quick wit and can get the place laughing, and a lot of times that diminishes the tension that sometimes builds on really critical issues that might have strong opposing sides.

Melanie Plenda:

On that note, any final thoughts you want to share with people about town meetings?

David Scanlan:

It is a great process, and I think that those of us that live in New England and in the original 13 colonies are fortunate to have this process that has developed and withstood the test of centuries. It's an amazing process. The further west that you go, the less and less the voters in those places have the same opportunities that we have to have these really great conversations about how the town affairs should be run.

Melanie Plenda:

Thank you New Hampshire Secretary of State David Scanlan. 

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communication at Franklin Pierce University. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visit collaborativenh.org.

Budget projections: What should we expect lawmakers to agree on this year?

Budget discussions are underway at the State House. These talks are about more than spending money — they look at the financial health of the state and set priorities for the next two years. What is the state’s financial outlook? What are its priorities for the next two years? Here to discuss that and more are Keene Sentinel State House reporter Rick Green and Anna Brown, executive director of Citizens Count and executive director of the Warren B. Rudman Center for Justice, Leadership and Public Service at the University of New Hampshire’s Franklin Pierce School of Law.

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

Melanie Plenda:

Rick, as lawmakers head into budget season, what’s the mood like at the State House right now? Are the Republican majorities in the House and Senate and governor getting along? What about the Democrats? Is everyone on the same page about the budget? 

Rick Green:

Well, it probably shouldn't be too surprising that Republican majorities in the House and Senate are generally on the same page with their Republican governor on most things, like expanding the school voucher system, not creating or raising new taxes and not changing the state's 24-week standard on the abortion law, for example. 

With the Republicans having that strong control in both chambers, they're kind of in a good position to exert their will, and Democrats are kind of in the role of being the vocal minority. They look to highlight differences on things like school funding and education policies and so-called sanctuary cities, and then also look for areas of agreement where they can provide school lunch aid for women after giving birth. So they're in that position of looking for opportunities, but not really being able to exert their will in a huge way.

Melanie Plenda:

Anna, what are the different approaches and how far off are they from each other? 

Anna Brown:

When we're looking at the budget, in particular, I think that there's actual agreement between Democrats and Republicans that we are entering a very difficult year in terms of revenue. There is falling business tax revenue, that federal money is gone — which was also earning a lot of interest in the state's bank accounts — and there's some pending lawsuits related to school funding and abuse at the juvenile detention center several decades ago. So all of this is coming with a pretty tough budget season. Even Governor Ayotte said herself that there's going to be a need for steep budget cuts.

That being said, I think that the governor is coming in with pretty rosy revenue projections. I think that the Republicans in the state Legislature are going to want to cut more deeply than she is. They've already said there's some difference there. 

For example, let's look at the Education Freedom Account Program, which lets students take the per-pupil share of state schools funding and spend it on private and homeschool expenses. The governor wants to expand that program so that all public school students are eligible, whereas Republicans in the Legislature were interested in expanding that to all students, including students currently enrolled in private schools. So that's a subtle difference. 

I think there are going to be other subtle differences like that. They're probably going to focus on the things that they can come together on, and do a lot of headlines about those. For example, banning cellphones in schools. The governor did include, I think it was just $1 million in her budget to help schools do that. In the big scheme of the budget, that's a very small amount, but it's seen as a bipartisan win, a win for the governor and the Legislature.

Melanie Plenda:

Here’s one for both of you — usually the New Hampshire budget goes beyond money matters. Is there any sense of what non-spending issues might crop up in it during this session? First to Rick, then to Anna.

Rick Green:

The Legislature will approve two budget bills. One is heavy on the actual spending numbers, and the other — the so-called budget trailer bill — looks more at policies and what's happened in past sessions.

If a bill can't make it through the Legislature on its own for whatever reason, you'll sometimes see the majority party try to take a second bite at the apple and slip that policy measure into the trailer bill, with the idea that this is a way to get that done and kind of force the governor's hand to either sign the whole budget, including that new policy, or reject it, which is always a hard thing for a governor to do. 

This, I think, has been more prevalent in previous years, when the Legislature was more evenly split between the two parties, but with strong Republican control in both chambers, whether they would have to resort to that sort of thing or just pass the policies as presented in the regular sessions, will be something we'll be watching.

Anna Brown:

The governor has already put some policy in that I wouldn’t say are strictly budget items. So for example, she wants to roll back bail reform that was passed in the past couple few years. Those were passed as standalone bills. They had nothing to do with the budget. She specifically said during her address, “Put this bill on my desk,” So that's clearly a priority for her. 

She also has included policies related to speeding up the housing permitting process in state government. So that definitely opens the door to some housing-related legislation or policies to end up in that state budget trailer bill. I don't know if that will happen, but I definitely think that that's one of the more controversial, tricky issues in the House and Senate, especially when it comes back to pushing back on local zoning laws.

Melanie Plenda:

Here’s another for you both — in the last few weeks, President Donald Trump has issued several executive orders that could have an impact on New Hampshire and its economy, especially his tariffs. How are those being received at the State House, and are there any concerns? 

Anna Brown:

A lot of this was unfolding right around when Governor Ayotte revealed her budget, and you didn't see any concern about this in her budget. Certainly she wasn't anticipating any big cuts to Medicaid funding. And remember, federal funding is roughly one-third of the state budget, and it supplies a huge amount of Medicaid funding, which in turn is a huge part of the state budget. So she seems to think that that's not going to be disrupted, whether it's an executive order or an act from Congress.  Also, her rosy projections on business tax revenue suggest that she's not expecting those tariffs to cause any problems, especially with business with Canada, which is a huge trading partner with New Hampshire.

That being said, I think that that conversation is out there. When I've talked to different economists and businesspeople in the state, it's on their mind, so I think it will inevitably become part of the budget discussion. But then again, we also saw protests at the State House over the past couple weeks from people opposing Donald Trump and his policies. There are some Republican legislators who posted about this on X and said they were unbothered, that they view this as all good policy developments. So it's definitely a little chaotic and unprecedented, but we're not really seeing a budget response yet.

Rick Green:

Federal funding in a range of areas potentially could be impacted, including student financial aid, immigration policies also could have an impact, but a lot of these orders have been or will be challenged in court. One lawsuit already filed in Concord challenges an executive order having to do with trans athletes — transgender girls on girls sports teams. So we'll kind of see how all that plays out.

Melanie Plenda:

What else should we all know about what’s happening or coming up at the State House? 

Rick Green:
I think housing is a really important issue at the State House right now. Public opinion polls indicate this is one of the biggest things on people’s minds. The median price of a home now in New Hampshire is topping a half-million dollars, and people of average means are having difficulty affording rent.

I think there's some determination to get more housing built in the state, and often it becomes an issue between local control and state mandates requiring that local officials take actions to be more encouraging toward development. 

Anna Brown:

I think that Republicans have been clear in the House, particularly that one of their top priorities is passing a parent bill of rights. We've seen various versions of this come up over the past few years — some of them dealing very specifically with gender, some of them more broadly just putting the existing rights into one place of state law. So that would include, for example, rights for parents to seek curriculum ahead of time and pull students out of class if they object. Other bills would go further and would say that teachers have to respond to parent requests within a certain amount of time or face consequences.

What that final bill looks like remains to be seen, but I think it’s going to really dig in to those tough social issues and school curriculum issues that have been so feisty for the past few years in New Hampshire. I’m sort of just waiting for that debate to bubble up and really explode in the House this year.

Melanie Plenda:

Thank you Keene Sentinel State House Reporter Rick Green and Anna Brown, executive director of Citizens Count and the Warren B. Rudman Center for Justice, Leadership and Public Service at the UNH Franklin Pierce School of Law.

What the Trump administration’s assault on DEI means for Granite Staters

In January, the Trump administration began efforts to remove and minimize DEI — diversity, equity and inclusion — initiatives in federally funded workplaces, schools and athletics. Across the country, businesses and organizations like PBS, the national public broadcasting service, are removing their DEI offices and programs. New Hampshire PBS is a member of the national service. Here to talk about what this means for Granite Staters is Anthony Poore, president and CEO of the New Hampshire Center for Justice & Equity. 

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

Melanie Plenda:

Anthony, what is the mission of your organization? 

Anthony Poore:

The mission of the New Hampshire Center for Justice & Equity is to empower and elevate New Hampshire's communities of color by making connections and meeting people so everyone can live their fullest life here in the Granite State. That's our mission. Our vision for our organization is to ensure that everybody who lives, works, plays or prays here in the Granite State,not only feels that they can belong, but their contributions matter to the greater good.

Melanie Plenda:

For our audience, let’s define what DEI is. When people use that term, what does it mean?

Anthony PooreIt depends on who you're asking. Over the course of the past year or so, for some the definition has changed. For myself, when I think about diversity, equity and inclusion, I actually move in the opposite direction, in the sense that what we're attempting to do through this work is create and develop inclusive policies and practices that lead to more equitable outcomes and create much more diverse environments. Instead of ensuring that everyone gets something, the goal here is to ensure people get what they need so they can contribute and live their best life.

Melanie Plenda:

With only 7.5% of New Hampshire’s population identifying as non-white, according to the 2024 Census. Why are these initiatives important in New Hampshire?

Anthony Poore:

Let's talk about young people right now, and I think this is where it's important. If you look at my daughters’ experience both 24 and 21 years of age, and you look at that particular cohort, or you look at kids under the age of 18 in New Hampshire right now, 20.2% of our kids under 18 reflect my daughter's lived experience — that is to say, their mother’s from Columbia, South America, their father happens to identify as a person of African descent here. 

So what I would argue, and this is some of the pushback that we are always trying to suggest to people that, yes, New Hampshire is still a majority white state. But that does not mean that the state is not increasingly becoming more and more diverse.  And as you know, had it not been for the in-migration of people into the state, not only would there be a loss of population, but those people that are coming in are both younger in terms of working age — between the ages of 18 and 44 — and the majority of people that are moving in the state are coming from international experiences or environments. They're coming from New England, with the vast majority of them coming from Massachusetts.

I think this discussion, or this argument, of “Why do we need to worry about diversity when we're not a very diverse state?” is not only inaccurate, but it paints us in a light that's not appropriate. I think about our school systems right now. Down in Manchester, Nashua, these are majority minority school systems, and are really at the cutting edge of our state's diversity.

Melanie Plenda:

What do you think is driving the executive orders on DEI? 

Anthony Poore:

To put it simply, white supremacy. What I argue oftentimes is that we've seen this playbook before. Now, I don't claim to be a history major by any stretch of the imagination, but I do know a little bit about history. When I think about this focus and us moving backwards on what I call some of our Great Society programs — rolling back the Civil Rights Act, rolling back the Voting Rights Act, thinking about the Fair Housing Act in 1968 and the demise of what I would call the Great Society.

Let's go back. Let’s think about the original sin called slavery, right? From there, let's talk about, for example, the Trail of Tears, where we force — relocated — thousands of Native Americans off fertile southern lands so rich white landowners could have access to those rich lands for the production of cotton to support the production of linen, cotton and so on. 

From there, let's talk about the Chinese Exclusion Act. For 60 years in this country, we excluded those of Chinese ancestry to immigrate into this wonderful nation of ours for fear of losing jobs, of them taking our “good jobs” away from us. We go from there, and of course, the post-Reconstruction period, the growth of Jim Crow, the 13th Amendment and so on. But then we get to World War II and the forced internment of Japanese Americans, thousands of Japanese Americans into places like Manzanar, and so on. I look at what we're seeing here as being historically accurate and not dissimilar to things that we've seen in the past. I think history is a wonderful teacher here. 

Many of us would argue right now we find ourselves in maybe the third or fourth Reconstruction period, or post-Reconstruction period, and we've seen these before. So we should not be surprised that those that might fear change or a fear of loss to see these things happen. So I'm not surprised, at least, and I don't think this is a new phenomenon. I think the issue of white supremacy and the fear of loss has been with us since almost the creation of this incredible nation of ours.

Melanie Plenda:

The state of New Hampshire DEI commission page was removed from the nh.gov website in early January. What impact do you see these actions having on New Hampshire and the country?

Anthony Poore:

Well, if I'm not mistaken, that group was finished, if you will, by executive order at the departure of our former governor. But I think when I look at what we see going on at the national level and at the state level is that that creates an enabling environment that somehow suggests that these kinds of behaviors, these processes, these tactics, are somehow OK. And by creating that enabling environment, it allows other folks, either at the state or local level, to act out in ways that they otherwise wouldn't do. 

As such, even our organization, which focuses on our disabilities community, our communities of color and our queer community, we've been the recipients of hate as of late,and this has just happened in the past two to three weeks, actually. Again, I think what we're seeing coming at us is a reflection of the kind of tactics and fear-mongering that we see at the national level beginning to play out at the local level.

Melanie Plenda:

Why do you think organizations that aren’t affected by the president’s executive order are altering their DEI programs?

Anthony Poore:

There were institutions and organizations who were changing their stance relative to DEI even before the executive orders, for fear of and so all those corporations shifted away from this DEI work well before our current administration took office, and, frankly, before the executive orders. I think some organizations — some, not all — were reading the tea leaves, if you will, and tried to get out in front of this problem before it becomes one, for fear of being targeted. 

At the same time, we've seen companies like Costco that I'll lift up and celebrate, who said that we recognize that, frankly, this DEI stuff is not a new phenomenon. It's a tried-and-true solution, and in lieu of targeting specific segments of our consumer base, we want to not only target all of our consumers, but ensure that we have a board and a staff that reflects our consumer base. So instead, we can get a little bit of everybody's money, if you will, and we think that's a good thing. 

I look at DEI as simply being good business, particularly in this space, because you have access to the greatest and largest talent pool, you have access to the largest consumer base, and we have the best talent and the largest consumer base, you can achieve economic prosperity. Honestly, as I think about this DEI and this anti immigration sentiment that exists here in the state, I often think about our local communities.

A dear friend of mine, a mentor, and I’ll call him out  — John Moore from Bangor Savings Bank — told me once that “doing good is good business.” And I think of DEI being good business, particularly in this space, because you have access to the greatest and largest talent pool, you have access to the largest consumer base, and with the best talent and largest consumer base you can achieve economic prosperity.

So, honestly, as I think about, particularly right now, this anti-immigration sentiment that exists here in the state, I also think about our local communities, and let me think about three sectors of our environment. First, I think about the hospitality sector and food service — it's one of the largest economic sectors in New Hampshire. I would argue that our hotels and motels cannot operate without immigrant labor who are here either as immigrants and refugees, or think about places like Santa's Village or the Mount Washington Resort, where young people come here on an H-2B visa to earn money during the summers and gain experience working internationally. 

Let's talk about our health care industry. I would argue, as a cancer survivor and somebody who spends a lot of time in hospitals, that Dartmouth-Hitchcock and other hospitals could not operate if it wasn't for foreign-born providers in our current system, and they require an H-1B visa. 

Or let’s talk about agriculture. Frankly, our agricultural sector, particularly dairy, could not survive if it wasn’t for our migratory laborers who come in based upon the seasonality of work 

So this anti-DEI sentiment, this anti immigration sentiment, not only affects us negatively from a business perspective — but when I think about our overall economic prosperity as a state, to just allow people to come here to work — at the end of the day is just cutting our nose to spite our face if we want to achieve economic prosperity that we all claim to want here in the Granite State.

Melanie Plenda:

What are the perceived benefits of removing DEI initiatives, if any? Who does this benefit?

Anthony Poore:

Mediocre talent. I founded the New Hampshire Center for Justice & Equity, alongside the board, three years ago. And, as any employer, I want the best and the brightest talent. I'm here in the nonprofit sector, but I'm competing actively with the for-profit sector for the smartest, the most hard-working, dedicated employees we can find. The idea of limiting that talent pool because I want people who reflect my own lived experience and not the lived experience of others, I think diminishes our opportunities at the local, state and national level. 

My grandfather used to tell me, “You never want to cut your nose and spite your face,” and I feel that this anti-DEI, anti-immigration sentiment is doing precisely that — we’re limiting our potential and our future opportunities.

Melanie Plenda:

The NHCJE’s website describes New Hampshire as one of the many states subjected to outside interests pushing an agenda to “normalize racism.” What do you mean by that?

Anthony Poore:

New Hampshire has 1.4 million people, and it is small enough to where if you want to move initiatives forward, you can do that in a way that almost represents a test case for other opportunities outside of New Hampshire. 

Let me give you an example — and this is not a discussion for or against, it's just an observation. If we think about current legislation right now to advance universal school vouchers here in New Hampshire. A lot of times people will talk about vouchers as a means to make a positive difference in kids who the traditional school system is failing. Here at the center, for example, we are not anti-voucher, what we're suggesting is for those that the voucher is intended to serve, let's do that work.

But historically, if you look at the utilization of vouchers, a lot of times are used for folks who are either homeschooled, participate in private school, or some combination of that. These typically tend to be middle- and upper middle-income individuals who may not need that additional subsidy. So we're seeing the parental rights movement, the school voucher pieces — all those things are advancing here in New Hampshire because New Hampshire is a smaller state. It gives us an opportunity to try these things out, if you will, and then bring them to scale in other states. So again, Free Staters moving into New Hampshire did not happen by coincidence. It was intentional, because they knew that they had the opportunity to push their agenda here further along, particularly given our citizen legislature and all the things that come along with that.

Melanie Plenda:

What is the New Hampshire Center For Justice and Equity planning to do about all this? 

Anthony Poore:

The first thing that we recognize is that the work continues. We're not going to stop doing what we believe to be really, really important work. 

One is to encourage people to recognize that New Hampshire is not a quote, unquote, lily white state that is diversifying, and that's important for people to recognize that. Number two, it's important to work with our allies and collaborators across the state. We're a statewide institution, but we want to continue to maybe blunt some of the negative activity that's taking place with respect to our communities of color and similarly marginalized populations.

So, in the short term, continue the work and blunt some of the negative things coming our way, but in the long term, begin to galvanize support at the local level that cuts across issues of age, gender, race, ethnicity, preference, identity or geography, and to bring together what we call people of a good conscience to form a coalition of what I'll call the willing. Because, at the end of the day, real power rests with the people.

But there's so much coming at us right now, people don't know where to go, frankly, and are looking for opportunities for mutual support. And so the New Hampshire Center for Justice & Equity, along with our allies, are intent on creating those safe places for communities so we can come together with one unified voice and an agenda that's been developed collectively that responds to our individual communities’ needs, but on issues of mutual concern we can all come together again with one voice and demonstrate our power. And that’s the direction we’re moving forward in.

Melanie Plenda:

Along those same lines, what can the average Granite Stater do about this?
Anthony Poore:

Number one, I think it's about really understanding and knowing our changing community. It's about staying informed and organizing around those issues that concern you. There's so much stuff being thrown at us right now. Identify two or three issues that you really care deeply about and find people that share that common concern and organize. 

When I think about our communities of color, our immigrant population, and so on, I think for those that want to be allies and collaborators and supporters, I think it's important that we build relationships with key leaders in those communities and those organizations — and, as appropriate, identify and advocate for those issues that directly affect those communities. 

I think, just from an accessibility perspective, we want to meet people where they're at, particularly as we're coming together, and accommodate for language or other accessibility issues. I think what we can all do is recognize that everything is local here in New Hampshire, and I think it's important to contact our local and state and federal delegation about issues that concern us so they can know that while there might be a vocal minority of people who may have negative thoughts, that the majority is really in the middle, and there are people of good conscience there who want to really engage in this work. 

Lastly, I think it's important that those that can to donate to organizations who are working directly with these communities, and if you can't donate, support their fundraising activities, so they can continue this good work and make sure that no matter where you come from, no matter how big your pocketbook is, no matter what your language of origin, that you know that New Hampshire is a place where you can live, work, play and pray, and that your contributions matter and you actually belong.

Melanie Plenda:

That was a great discussion. Thank you Anthony Poore, president and CEO of the New Hampshire Center for Justice and Equity.

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communication at Franklin Pierce University. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visitcollaborativenh.org.

What are New Hampshire lawmakers’ priorities for 2025?

A new session has started at the State House in Concord, but some of the bills lawmakers are proposing seem to be old favorites. What else are they proposing? On this episode of “The State We’re In,” Anna Brown, executive director of Citizens Count and executive director of the Warren B. Rudman Center for Justice, Leadership and Public Service at the University of New Hampshire’s Franklin Pierce School of Law, talks about what’s coming up in the next few months.

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

Melanie Plenda:

Can you give us a high-level overview of some of the bills we’ll see in front of the State House this term? I imagine there are new proposals as well as some old favorites returning for Round 2, or in some cases, Round 22.

Anna Brown:

Yes. When I think about three big hot topics that are happening this year, it's housing, school policies and curriculum, and immigration.

Housing has been a top issue for many years. There is now a housing committee in the House of Representatives that is dedicated to bills looking at this issue. The challenge is that a lot of what the state can do right now is pushing back on local zoning laws, and there's a big tradition of local control in New Hampshire, where towns and cities set their own zoning regulations. 

Many of those proposals are coming up that have been proposed in previous years. For example, limiting parking requirements, limiting minimum or maximum lot sizes, and so on. Those bills are coming back around, and we're going to see where they go this year in terms of school policies and curriculum.

In terms of school policies and curriculum, some of these are repeats — for example, a “parental bill of rights.” There’s another bill that would require teachers to respond to parent inquiries within a certain amount of time, or if they're worried for a student answering that question, then they would have to report it to the Department of Health and Human Services. 

Something new this year is the No Screens in Classrooms Act. This was brought up by Gov. Kelly Ayotte in her inaugural address, and it would ban cell phone use in the classroom during instruction time, unless a teacher is specifically incorporating it, or a student has needs for an assistive device. A lot of these other school bills are definitely variations on a theme from previous years.

Then immigration enforcement — that’s another big priority that Governor Ayotte brought up in her inaugural address. She's looking to ban sanctuary cities in New Hampshire, which I actually don't think is the most controversial immigration issue this year, because it's not really a huge, common thing in New Hampshire that you're going to have a lot of tension between police and Immigration and Customs Enforcement. In New Hampshire, there are only a couple cities or towns that have ordinances that might fall under that category. So that one is getting attention, but I'm looking more at immigration-related issues, on requiring employers to use E-verify, banning out-of-state immigrant licenses, and so on, and seeing where those issues will unfold.

Melanie Plenda:

Let’s drill down a bit on some of the other issues expected to come up this session. First, let’s talk about the state budget. What’s happening there? And how will that affect people? 

Anna Brown:

I could have answered the entire first question about important legislation by just saying “budget, budget and budget.”

The New Hampshire budget is how we really set our most important priorities, and it's going to be a tough one. Governor Ayotte has already said to expect to tighten your belt. She's already put a hiring freeze on at the state level, and that's because there's several challenges going on.

The federal COVID money that was floating around for several years and earning a lot of interest for the state is all gone now. Business tax revenue is slowing down, and the state is facing a few really challenging lawsuits related to school funding, related to juvenile detention, and the ultimate bill on those is anybody's guess.

We already have a shoestring budget for our state compared to a lot of other states. We know there are almost certainly going to have to be cuts. The governor has said as much. She will give her proposal in February, usually right around Valentine's Day — It’s easy to remember that way — so I'm really going to be curious to see where she's proposing cuts and where she's proposing to hold the line.

She's already said that she's very concerned about mental health. She's very concerned about first responders and law enforcement. So we can presume that she's not going to be looking to make cuts there. But honestly, anything else at state government is on the table.

Melanie Plenda:

There are also bills concerning child abuse up for consideration this session. What are those about? Are they related to some of the horrific cases that have made headlines in the past year?

Anna Brown:

There is a lot of bipartisan concern around child protection in New Hampshire. There are bills looking to criminalize neglect, expand definitions of child endangerment, add more assumptions that harm is occurring — so basically making it easier to remove a child from the home or prosecute — and requiring more interaction and cooperation between child safety workers and police. And this is in response to some high-profile cases. Harmony Montgomery, of course, was murdered by her own father, and it was a really tragic case that has been unfolding over multiple years as more information is uncovered about reports that were made or maybe not followed up on, and where communication didn't happen across state lines or in different departments. So definitely, those bills, I think, have a good chance of moving forward. People are trying to shore up the system. A big challenge, though, is if you don't have enough child protection workers, and people are getting burned out, and they have too large of a caseload — this is going to continue to be an issue in New Hampshire.

So this is another issue that I think might get explored during the state budget process as well, because even if you have wonderful laws, if you don't have enough people working to investigate and protect children, we're going to continue to see failures.

Melanie Plenda:

There’s also a bill aimed at no-cause evictions. What is that about? How will that impact people?

Anna Brown:

This is another repeat bill from years past, and it's sponsored by Rep. Bob Lynn, who is a former chief justice of the New Hampshire Supreme Court, so he definitely carries some weight in the House of Representatives. 

This bill would basically allow a landlord to just choose not to renew a lease. Under current law, there has to be some cause, so they can't just say, “No I don't want to rent to you anymore.” It's intended to prohibit discrimination. But the reason this bill is coming up is that there's an idea that, OK, maybe if landlords have the ability to get rid of bad tenants more easily it would encourage more people to become landlords. This is another way to maybe ease the affordable housing crisis in New Hampshire.

The flip side of this is that people are concerned that there will be a movement to just flip tenants and keep on raising rents, and that you can be as picky and discriminatory as you like. Of course, it would still be illegal to actively discriminate against people. But this is the debate. This is the reason why the bill has come up time and time again, and we're going to see if this is the year that it goes forward.

Melanie Plenda:

So, amidst all this, there are also federal mandates coming down the pike. So what is going on with the federal funding freeze, and how will that affect New Hampshire?

Anna Brown:

This is a constantly changing situation. Over a period of just a few days, we saw a complete federal funding freeze. Medicaid portals went down temporarily. There's some debate about whether that was a technical glitch or intentional. Then the Trump administration said they were lifting the order that implemented the freeze, but were still going to continue the review of federal funds. That's a very uncertain environment.

I think the challenge in New Hampshire is how to plan for this going forward, because there are big potential impacts on the budget. At the highest level, about one-third of all of the revenue that's in the New Hampshire budget comes from the federal government, and that might go to roads or schools or contracts for other community services. And it's worth noting that, with our shoestring budget compared to other states, a lot of our social service programs — whether it's after-school programs or public health programs, essential services for new mothers, maybe services for veterans — are coming from nonprofits that get government contracts. So this potential federal funding freeze — it's hard to understate the impact it could have in New Hampshire. But since the landscape continues to change so much on a daily basis, we can't know for sure what ultimately is going to happen.

Melanie Plenda:

Do you expect any of President Trump’s recent executive orders to have an impact on New Hampshire in the coming months? 

Anna Brown:

Absolutely — that's almost undeniable. I've discussed the scope of a federal funding freeze potentially in New Hampshire. Even freezing some of those grants or specific areas of funding could have a very large impact in a state that relies so much on that funding. That being said, it could be a small impact or a big one.

There was also a recent Trump executive order that's looking to expand school choice. So we know that New Hampshire has the Education Freedom Account program, and that allows students to take the per-pupil share of public school funding and spend it on private and homeschool expenses. Is there a world where the Trump administration would support funding that program? It's not impossible.

At this point, I would say the executive orders are written in really broad legal language that leaves a lot of room for interpretation. So absolutely — there will be an impact, and I think it's just up to journalists and nonprofits like Citizens Count and the UNH Law School, and everyone else to just be doing their best to keep reading and talking to each other and doing their best to plan for what might happen.

Melanie Plenda:

Thank you Anna Brown, executive director of Citizens Count as well as executive director of the Warren B. Rudman Center for Justice, Leadership & Public Service at the University of New Hampshire’s Franklin Pierce School of Law.

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communication at Franklin Pierce University. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visit collaborativenh.org.

From incarceration to independence: How Dismas Home helps women rebuild their lives in New Hampshire

How does someone move on from being incarcerated? It can’t be easy, but our guests on this episode of “The State We’re In” — Julie McCarthy-Brown, founder, and Cheryll Andrews, executive director, of Dismas Home of New Hampshire — know something about how to do it successfully and why it’s important for the entire community. 

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

Melanie Plenda:

Julie, tell us about Dismas Home in Manchester and how it came to be.

Julie McCarthy-Brown:

First of all, I'd like to change “formerly incarcerated women” to “women that are involved in the justice system,” because we serve women throughout the justice system. The state is moving to restoring and helping women grow, and not just from incarceration, but they come from all areas.

The namesake comes from the penitent thief who died on the cross next to Christ. Before he died, he asked Christ for forgiveness and he was given forgiveness, and we want these women to have forgiveness. His namesake is St. Dismas, and it’s called Dismas Home of New Hampshire.

In most of the other states it’s called Dismas House, but we wanted a home, not a house, because these women have never had truly a good home that’s a safe environment for them. We give them the space and the time to recover from the trauma that got them in trouble in the first place.  

Cheryll Andrews:

So the state is moving towards a more restorative process instead of just punitive. So we consider women “justice-involved,” and that could mean pretrial services. We get calls from public defenders. We get calls from the drug courts, because they plead into drug court, and they need a partner, a housing partner, and so we work with them. We do take women from the prison. We take women from the jails. We take them from other programs that they might be involved in — a detox, a 28-day program. So they all have levels of justice involvement, probation and parole — any of those connections give us a place to reach out to women. And we have recently extended our service catchment to include women veterans who are justice-involved.

Melanie Plenda:

And, why was it important to go beyond just the people who were incarcerated to these other aspects of the justice system?

Cheryll Andrews:

If I'm really direct, if we can catch them before they're actually sentenced and put into a situation where they're incarcerated for a number of years it serves them better. And, because the state is moving away from long-term incarceration, they’re still justice-involved. They still have all the stigmas and obstacles attached to their re-entry into the community, including their substance misuse, but they haven't had four years in prison or 18 months in jail. It might have been a shorter stint with probation or community service or some other piece that still connects them to the justice system. But it's not directly incarceration.

Melanie Plenda:

Cheryll, tell us more about the programs of Dismas Home. What does it offer, and how does it help women?

Cheryll Andrews:

So one of the things that we are asked often is, “What do you mean Dismas Home? Is this a faith-based organization?” And my answer is we are a 501c3 nonprofit organization and we are not faith-driven. But I will tell you that a whole lot of people who have a lot of faith are behind the scenes helping us move all the pieces forward. But we do not preach doctrine, and we ask women to connect with their higher power and work and find a spiritual place for themselves, but we do not dictate that, and we don't preach doctrine. That's definitely a question that we're often asked. 

Our program is a Level 3.1 ASAM (American Society of Addiction Medicine) — it’s a national mental health care standard, and it means that we have a set program. They are required to have one hour with the clinician a week, one hour with the drug and alcohol counselor a week. They have to have three immediate group therapy meetings a week in house, and we take them to several outside community meetings every week. So that's the core of it. Plus we are staffed 24/7 with recovery support workers, meaning if they're struggling with something, they can talk to somebody 24/7 here. 

It's a pretty strict program, and residents come to us on a volunteer basis. They have to want to come. I can't make them come, and I can't make them stay. That is key to their ability to move themselves forward, because they're here on their own accord. They can pick up and leave anytime they want, and they can make the choice to stay.  It's pretty important. 

Then when they move into the transitional living program, they move into heavy case management, where we begin to really help them focus on the plan to leave us, because it's going to come, and we need to help you figure out what that looks like and how to get there. It might be education, it might be a driver's license, it might be finding housing. It's certainly about helping them find meaningful work that's not a get-well job, which is something like Dunkin’ Donuts or McDonald’s. It's a meaningful job where they will earn benefits and wages that will help them move forward to an independent level and all of the surrounding support that needs to happen.

Melanie Plenda:

Julie, how does Dismas Home support itself? 

Julie McCarthy-Brown:

We support ourselves in many different areas. We take donations, we do grants, we have corporate sponsors, volunteering — our board, for instance, is totally 100% volunteers — and they give up their time and they’re all ages. 

We have volunteers that come in. We have a book club starting right now. We have a woman who just became a professional chef, and she's coming in to work with the women. We have canine therapy. We have equine therapy. We have a lot of different programs in which people can support if they are just able to volunteer. Sometimes we have to find someone to help them get a GED, get them through that paperwork and the process to have that behind them, because there are some that arrive with no high school education. 

We also work with colleges. If a woman wants to become a vet tech, we find a scholarship for her so that she can fulfill those dreams and have a very meaningful life — something she loves going forward. Because, if you enjoy your job, it's not work.

Melanie Plenda:

Here’s a question for both of you — why is a place like this needed? Let’s start with Julie then to Cheryll. 

Julie McCarthy-Brown:

You need long-term help overcoming what you've grown up with and how you've lived in your life. Sometimes our women come with 25 years of addiction — selling drugs, being on the street, you don't know. We don't ask them their story — they’ve learned never to trust anybody, and they really just can't fathom the fact that people that don't know them personally would support them financially and would care enough to come and help them. It's very important to have that underpinning. 

When you see them succeed — I equate it to a rose blooming. When they bloom and it's fully fragrant, it is gorgeous to watch — very, very fulfilling to work with this population. I'm blessed to be able to have somebody like Cheryl who runs around very diligently for us.

Cheryll Andrews:

The personal connection for me is this:I have a sister who spent some time in jail, probably more than 20 years ago now, and when she came out, I had no way of helping her. I had no resources. I had nobody to tell me how to help her get herself moving. She was fortunate enough to find a program that helped her, and she is now living her most beautiful life with her family. So when I came to Dismas Home, I wanted to help somebody else's sister, because maybe family isn't the right place for them to go, or they certainly don't have the clinical skills. 

Women don't know how much help that they need because they built this steel cage around themselves of no trust. It's survival mode. But what they want is what the rest of us want — a normal, healthy, happy life, free of addiction, free of all this craziness that goes on because of the addiction, and to move forward to be able to have their children and enjoy going grocery shopping and have a home, the simple things in life that we all take for granted. They don't take any of it for granted, and there are so many of them — on average, over the course of a year, it's about 2,000 women in the state of New Hampshire who are justice-involved, and we can help right now. 

Melanie Plenda:

I’m sure people understand how Dismas Home helps these women, but let’s talk a little bit more about how it can also help the community.

Cheryll Andrews:

The argument is the humanity, right? The human side of things. I want to help her. She deserves help. She shouldn't have to live this way. It helps her. It helps her family. It helps break that cycle of recidivism and substance misuse. It keeps her from teaching those bad habits to her children. It helps her to find new ways to be successful, and that helps the community at large.

It offers her an opportunity to go to work. Our unemployment rate is really low, and there are boatloads of jobs out there, so if we can help someone get back into the workforce — we're helping the community on that foot. If she’s also a taxpaying citizen, she’s also contributing to society by paying her taxes. We're also helping save the state money on the other end because she's not in and out, in and out, in and out of the jail system relentlessly, or she's not living on the street where she could freeze or where she could die from anything. So if you're looking at it from the human perspective, we're helping a small chunk, a very small drop in the bucket, of people who need help. But if we can help one, and then she can help one, then we're helping more than one, and we're hopefully making that ripple effect in the community. 

Melanie Plenda:

Julie, what are your plans for the future of the organization? 

Julie McCarthy-Brown:

Cheryl always laughs at me when I talk about this. The dream 11 years ago was to have a home in every county in the state for women, and probably some for men, too. We've been asked to do it for men, but right now, the women have nothing — and that's where we're concentrating our efforts. We’ll eventually have one for men, but we'd like to have at least 10 homes.

Melanie Plenda:

And for those who would like to offer help or support, what do you need and how can they do it?

Cheryll Andrews:

Anyone who wants to help us in a wide variety of ways can send an email to info@Dismashomenh.org. Visit the website, do a little research, pick up the phone and call us. 

We're always open to lots of ideas and possibilities all the time. We have a group of volunteers that come to us from the Manchester Area Human Resources Association, and that organization has about 180 members, and they come once a month. There's a group of women who come once a month, and they do interviewing skills and resume-building skills, and how to dress for an interview, talking about what kinds of work they might want to do when they leave here or eventually, and trying to help them sort out what do I need to get there? Sometimes the conversations are pretty short, but they're planting seeds all the time to help them move themselves forward. 

You know, our motto is, “You can always make another choice.” So if today you're not making the best choice, you can make another choice today. You can make another choice tomorrow. So it's important that they know that their future is in their hands.

Melanie Plenda:

Julie McCarthy-Brown and Cheryll Andrews from Dismas Home of New Hampshire, thank you for joining us today. 

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communication at Franklin Pierce University. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visitcollaborativenh.org.

In the wake of the COVID pandemic, what viruses concern experts today?

While the COVID-19 pandemic may be over, our concerns about another virus leading to another one will likely never go away. What viruses are concerning doctors and health officials now? Here to discuss current health concerns is infectious disease specialist Dr. Michael Calderwood, chief quality officer at Dartmouth Hitchcock Medical Center.

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

Melanie Plenda:

As an infectious disease specialist, how are things looking this season? What are you watching and what are your concerns? 

Michael Calderwood:

We often see in the winter months, and particularly after the holidays at the end of December, an increase in a number of viral illnesses, many of them hitting at the same time. Things like the common cold — which is caused actually by a few different viruses — flu, RSV and norovirus and the impact that's had on families.

Melanie Plenda:

In terms of bird flu, what is concerning about this virus, and why are we watching human cases so closely? 

Michael Calderwood:

Avian influenza, which goes by the other name H5N1, can cause very severe illness in animals and has the potential to be transmissible to humans. We have seen cases, and have now recorded our first death from avian influenza in the United States. 

That individual who died was older and had some comorbidities, and so it wasn't unexpected that they might have a more severe outcome from that illness. The worry is that if it were to mutate and become more transmissible — meaning that we have human to human transmission or spread in communities — it can cause very severe illness. Also, it has that potential to cause a pandemic that is what is worrying.

Melanie Plenda:

Can you tell us more about the recent human cases? 

Michael Calderwood:

Up until this point, we have seen fairly mild illness, and when we think about avian influenza, a lot of what we have seen is individuals who are working with animals — it may infect things such as the eyes from direct contact or cause mild respiratory illness. This individual ended up with a severe lower respiratory tract illness, ended up in an ICU and died. Again, that is the severe form, and as this mutates, the worry as we could see more of that.

Melanie Plenda:

How are health officials tracking this and other cases of flu? 

Michael Calderwood:

We have the ability to test for all the different types of flu, so when individuals come into health care — whether that be seeing a provider in the outpatient setting or coming into an emergency or hospital setting — we can test for flu and tell what type of flu it is. There is state-level and national-level testing actually looking to characterize what is circulating. That's gone on for years, because it's important to know what's circulating so that we can match the vaccines and make sure that we are updating those each year. 

Melanie Plenda:

What about COVID? Is that still a concern this season? 

Michael Calderwood:

If you look at the respiratory viruses that are circulating right now, COVID is actually the lowest that it has been in recent years, and a lot of that is related to population immunity, much through vaccination.

We are seeing more influenza — that began to peak a little bit about a week earlier than it has in years past. RSV is about 20% higher this year. And we are seeing a number of other viruses. I will say that we actually have tests for a lot of viruses that we didn't routinely use in past years. We would always say, ‘“This is just the common cold,”, but not test for it. Now we can put a name to it and say what is circulating. It doesn't mean it wasn't always there. It just means that we are detecting it more on tests.

Melanie Plenda:

We’ve also heard a lot recently about norovirus. Can you tell us more about what that is and why it’s concerning? 

Michael Calderwood:

Norovirus is a highly transmissible virus, and it causes a gastrointestinal illness. It really attacks pretty much the entire family, if one were to get it. When it comes into a household, you see pretty much everyone in the family falling ill. It's about 48 hours, typically, in terms of its duration. But that 48 hours is very severe. You're having vomiting and diarrhea at the same time, feeling very rundown and fatigue. We tend to see over time that new strains will emerge. This is the first new strain in about seven years. 

Prior to this, people who had been exposed to norovirus had some level of immunity and maybe didn't have as severe of an illness. With this new strain being introduced into the population, this year is worse for norovirus, and a lot of people's holiday plans were unfortunately disrupted by this. I've described this as being quite memorable. Thankfully, my family and I have not suffered this time, but we have had it in the past, and it is definitely something that sets you back when it runs through your family.

Melanie Plenda:

How worried should we be about that? 

Michael Calderwood:

I would say that this is a natural trend, that every decade or so you're going to see a new strain that develops. This is running its course. I would say that I'm not particularly worried long term about the impact of this.

Melanie Plenda:

What should we do to stay healthy? 

Michael Calderwood:

So there are a number of things. Obviously, as the weather turns cold, we're going to spend more time inside and gather with others. As we've learned in years past, when you are ill you're at risk of transmitting that illness to others, and particularly respiratory illness. So staying home when you're sick, thinking about wearing a mask to protect others when you need to go out in the community. Frequent hand washing is critical at all times, but particularly in the winter months, when we know that we have more of these illnesses that are spread by secretions, such as a runny nose. 

Then, as we think about things like norovirus, washing hands with norovirus is best with soap and water. Alcohol-based hand rubs are very good for respiratory viruses, but norovirus in particular requires soap, water, and bleach is important for cleaning the environment. I also mentioned food-handling, and at any time you want to be thinking about how you are handling raw food and how you're washing your hands.

Melanie Plenda:

When should we seek medical help? 

Michael Calderwood:

When you are feeling ill — a lot of us kind of have a sense. So if we begin to have difficulty breathing - many people these days actually may have the ability to measure their oxygen at home — If you see your oxygen levels are dropping. Obviously, if people are having difficulty breathing while they sleep, or if you see anyone that appears to be changing color. These are very severe things that you'd want to bring people into the hospital for. 

But the other thing is who might benefit from treatment? We have medicines for flu, we have medicines for a number of different conditions. and so coming in to be tested, we can treat your COVID, we can treat your flu — and particularly if you have underlying illnesses that would predispose you, whether it be your age or your diabetes or medicines that suppress your immune system — we can help to protect you, get you better sooner if you take these medicines.

Melanie Plenda:

Has the pandemic changed or had an impact on the way the hospital responds to these and other virus concerns? 

Michael Calderwood:

What was interesting is that we actually had pretty good systems in place even before the pandemic. We are always taking a global look and seeing what might be on the horizon.Obviously, a lot of this grew out of earlier pandemics, whether this be from the initial SARS or from the risk of Ebola, or even the 2009 H1N1. We have teams that are meeting regularly to say, “What do we need to be concerned about that is coming around the corner?” 

I actually remember the initial conversations in December 2019 as we began to see the emergence of SARS COVID 2, the virus that causes COVID. But we had systems in place to say, “How do we begin to screen people? How do we make sure that we are setting up the hospital to be able to handle that?” Obviously, the pandemic made us strengthen some of those systems. I am worried about the fact that we are reducing some of our public health infrastructure at a time when it will increasingly be necessary, but I would say that the hospitals continue to be on a footing of preparedness.

Melanie Plenda:

What about society as a whole? Should we think about changing the way we live or vacation or work when we see some of these things?

Michael Calderwood:

I would say that you always want to be looking at where you're traveling and what might be circulating, and for particular places, it is helpful to get some pre-travel consultation. We here at Dartmouth Health have a travel clinic and can help to think about vaccines and medicines you might take to protect yourself during your travel. 

The other thing is to understand the availability of health care resources where you're going, particularly if you take medicines and have underlying illness, understand if you were to fall sick, how would you get help? What are the hospitals? How could you fly home if you were sick? These are standard things I would say for anyone who is traveling, not that I'm particularly worried and saying don't travel to location X, Y or Z at the present time, but it's always important to understand what is in those areas you might be traveling to.

I love to travel. I think travel is something that we can do a lot more of, and it's nice to be able to get back to it after the pandemic, but we just think about how we do it safely.

Melanie Plenda:

That was fascinating. Infectious disease expert Dr. Michael Calderwood, chief quality officer at Dartmouth Hitchcock Medical Center, thank you so much for joining us today. 

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communication at Franklin Pierce University. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visitcollaborativenh.org.

How a warmer climate is changing access to water, New Hampshire’s most precious resource

Water may be our most basic and precious resource, however, as the New Hampshire climate gets warmer and wetter, residents and towns are finding it increasingly difficult to get access to it. On this episode of “The State We’re In,” Melanie Plenda talks with Mary Stampone, New Hampshire state climatologist and an associate professor of geography at the University of New Hampshire, whose undergraduate courses in environmental geography include courses on weather, climate, and natural hazards.

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

Melanie Plenda:

The region is in the midst of a drought. What does that look like in New Hampshire? And what led to the drought here? 

Mary Stampone:

Drought in New England is typically caused by a lack of precipitation, but it can be exacerbated by temperature. For example, in summer, the higher temperatures can cause more water to evaporate from lakes, ponds and soil, and this can cause conditions to deteriorate rapidly during long spells without rain. But in winter, we're largely concerned with groundwater levels, because at temperatures below freezing, frozen ground limits groundwater recharge from the surface — under normal conditions, we also see most of our water on the surface as snow. So drought conditions tend to persist through the winter months until spring.

Melanie Plenda:

What needs to happen over the winter or into the spring to alleviate these drought conditions?
Mary Stampone:

Recent rainfall over the holidays allowed for some slow improvement, but groundwater levels are still below normal. We really need to see some snow. Ideally, we want to have a consistent snowpack through the winter, through early spring, followed by a slow, steady snowmelt to balance the water use during the spring leaf-out, which can draw a lot of groundwater when we already have low groundwater levels.

Melanie Plenda:

Is that likely to happen this year, do you think? 

Mary Stampone:

It's hard to say for now, but we still have plenty of winter left. One of the concerns, though, going forward is that as our winters have warmed, we're seeing more instances of snowmelts as well as rain on snow events within the winter season. In the short term, that water can keep conditions from deteriorating in real time, but it lessens the amount of snow melt going into the spring, which can exacerbate spring dryness. 

Melanie Plenda:

Is it true that, generally, New Hampshire’s climate is getting warmer and wetter — and if so, then why are we going through a drought? 

Mary Stampone:

We are overall becoming warmer and wetter, but we still have a substantial variability in how much precipitation we get from year to year, season to season, month to month.

What we also see as we get warmer is that the precipitation is coming in these bigger events, and we're kind of getting it all at once, rather than having it spread out. Then you combine that with the warmer temperatures, and we have a potential for having longer, drier periods between rain events that leaves us vulnerable to drought.

Melanie Plenda:

How will all this affect New Hampshire’s agriculture? 

Mary Stampone:

We've already seen some substantial impacts on agriculture, but given these impacts from recent droughts, many farmers, in coordination with state agencies, are really investing in building drought resiliency, which can include everything from more infrastructure — but probably more importantly — more water-efficient practices that will, long term, reduce our vulnerability to drought. 

Melanie Plenda:

So many New Hampshire residents rely on wells. What can they do to prepare for a drier future? 

Mary Stampone:

First and foremost, reduce water use where you can. Consider your indoor water use, and if you are able to invest in more water-efficient appliances, that's a great start. Consider your outdoor water use. If you have a garden, hand-water if possible, think about your yard and having a perfect green grass yard made of clover — other plants like that — can be more drought-resistant and still look nice. So think about your individual water use and try to conserve where you can. 

Melanie Plenda:

What can towns do to help with this issue? What sort of proposals are on the table?
Mary Stampone:

I know several towns in the Seacoast have invested in redundant water systems so we have one or more than one water source. If we rely on stream flow and if stream levels are low, we can go to a groundwater system — things like that.

Water regulations are also a tool — limiting outdoor water use or un-essential water use during the driest parts of the summer season can help. Also education — educating citizens on water use in ways that individuals can reduce.

Melanie Plenda:

What about at the state level? What can be done there to help alleviate the problem?

Mary Stampone:

Policy and support for communities during drought periods can greatly improve our resilience, but assistance for towns and individuals to increase water efficiencies as well as improve infrastructure. A lot of the investments that the state made following the 2001 drought and as well as in the 2016 drought, for people to dig deeper wells or, again, grants to improve water efficiencies, have all actually helped build resilience to drought. All of these improvements help us as we kind of move into this future where we may see, may see more summer drought.

Melanie Plenda:

Is that more of a tough sell, given some of legislators’ attitudes about climate change? 

Mary Stampone:

I don't think it should. I mean, these are practices that our state agencies and our state government have already engaged in in recent droughts dating back decades. This isn't a new phenomenon for New Hampshire. We do see dry periods from time to time, and these investments have been made in the past, and I don't see why these policies should change in the future.

The impacts can be great, and they impact our economy — agriculture, but also tourism, water quality, water availability, and so these are pressures that we've faced for a while, and we'll continue to face, and our state has addressed them, and hopefully they'll continue to do that.

Melanie Plenda:

What advice do you have for New Hampshire residents who are concerned about this issue?

Mary Stampone:

At the individual level, think about how you use water, and if there are ways that you can be more efficient in your water use and reduce your water use. Going forward, every drop counts. And one thing going into the summer season is that the soils are going to use more water, plants are going to use more water, people are going to use more water. But we don't know how much rain we're going to get, and in the winter, we don't know how much snow we're going to get. Building in water-efficiency practices, regardless of the drought conditions, is a really good thing that people can do.

Melanie Plenda:

Mary Stampone, New Hampshire state climatologist and associate professor of geography at the University of New Hampshire, thank you for joining us today. 

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communication at Franklin Pierce University. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visitcollaborativenh.org.

N.H. journalists weigh in on 2024's biggest stories and prospects for 2025

The year 2024 had many firsts and a bit of deja vu. We saw a spirited presidential election — first between former and now President-elect Donald Trump and current President Joe Biden, and later between Trump and Vice President Kamala Harris. As we bid goodbye to 2024, let’s take a look back at some of the major stories and issues that dominated headline — and look ahead to what 2025 holds — with three veteran journalists: Keene Sentinel managing editor for audience development Jack Rooney, Manchester Ink Link editor and publisher Carol Robidoux and Laconia Daily Sun reporter Gabriel Perry.

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

Melanie Plenda:

Let’s start with the presidential election. What were some of the highlights of 2024 election coverage? 

Jack Rooney:

Thinking back to January and the presidential primary, it's almost easy to forget that Joe Biden wasn't even on the ballot in the Democratic primary in New Hampshire and ended up winning as a write-in candidate. I also think New Hampshire did still keep its first-in-the nation primary status, bucking the [Democratic National Committee’s] wishes.

It was a different time. Nikki Haley was still challenging Trump for the Republican nomination, and there was maybe a little bit of uncertainty going into the New Hampshire primary that Haley could mount a sustained challenge to President-elect Trump. But the New Hampshire primary seemed to be a bit of a turning point for Haley and for Trump, and it seemed inevitable that he was going to win the nomination for a third straight time.
Then, here in Keene, in the Monadnock Region, which tends to be a pretty liberal, progressive corner of the state ended up being, you know, having signs of a bit of a red wave. Vice President Harris did win Cheshire County, and obviously won the state of New Hampshire as well, but she ran several points behind Joe Biden in Keene and Cheshire County compared to the 2020 election. So even though Vice President Harris won New Hampshire's electoral votes and the federal delegation remained Democratic, at the State House level and statewide, New Hampshire was part of that kind of red wave as well.

Gabriel Perry:

We really experienced a lot of audience engagement about the election. the whole time. Our letters section was extremely lively all the way up to the day. Something I found particularly interesting this time around was that there seemed to be quite a link or an influence on local and state races. It seemed like all roads led to the presidential election, and people referred to either candidate pretty consistently throughout all of their campaigns as well. So it was pretty fascinating to see the influence that had.

Melanie Plenda:

What about your top statewide stories of the year? As you look back, what were some of the biggest stories at the state level? 

Jack Rooney:

For us at the Sentinel, a lot of the statewide stories that we followed continued to be really how state-level policies and politics played out at the local level. For instance, the school funding debate in New Hampshire — the constitutional challenge is back before the Supreme Court, led by the ConVal school district based in Peterborough, which is within our coverage area. And while that's a big statewide issue and a big statewide story, we see the effects of it at the local level all the time. 

Gabriel Perry:

Something we spent a lot of time covering, that maps on to pretty much every region in the state is the development of housing and everything that goes along with that. As we see people increasingly interested in coming to New Hampshire to live their lives and start families here, we also see at the same time that not every area necessarily has the infrastructure or the housing stock to support it, so stuff like that really kind of took the forefront throughout much of the state this year. 

Carol Robidoux:

I'm going to roll back to the total eclipse, which was kind of like an eclipse-chasing moment for all of New Hampshire. We were so close to places where you could really go to get that full view, and it created an odd sense of community in a way where people were jumping on buses and going to Vermont or up north to find a place where they could hang out and be with other people when the skies went black for a minute, and it was pretty neat. So that was fun. 

As far as politics, I would say, the biggest impact here in Manchester in particular was the gubernatorial race and some of the negative campaigning by Kelly Ayotte, who eventually won. But she was running against the former mayor of Manchester, Joyce Craig, and she went very negative with her advertising, portraying Manchester as a place that even the rats probably wouldn't want to live. It really struck a chord with the business community that there was some backlash on that. I think if she comes to Manchester in 2025 she's going to need to go on a goodwill tour to build back the good feelings.

Melanie Plenda:

What about the local level? What were some of the biggest stories in your respective regions?

Gabriel Perry:

Something that more recently became a prime issue, but has been in the news for quite a while is the sale and development of the State School property located in Laconia. That's sort of a state and a local story. It's been fascinating to follow. There's a whole lot of contingencies around it that people have their skepticisms about and their anxieties. Also, people, especially business owners in the area, seem to be looking forward to that potential. It's sort of a symbol of the revitalization of the area. 

The state school is a large property owned by the state and located in Laconia. It was formerly the site of a prison and a mental health center at different points, and there's been sort of this like long, winding saga over the past number of years in terms of selling it to a real estate developer and turning it into something productive for the future. A major deal fell through earlier in the year, and that deal included a very high sales price. In more recent months, a different developer, the Pillsbury Realty Group, actually won the contract to purchase the land and develop the property. So that's well underway in terms of the planning phase right now, and people feel somewhat burned by the original deal, which didn't end up coming to fruition. 

Carol Robidoux:

Housing is really in the forefront of everything that the media is covering here in New Hampshire. The New Hampshire Coalition to End Homelessness recently issued a report based on the last point-in-time count from earlier in the year, citing New Hampshire as having the highest increase in homelessness of of all 50 states, where the national average was like a 12% increase — we had like a 52% increase

That statistic hopefully will generate some interest in Concord to look at the state as a whole and see that the major cities like Laconia, Manchester, Concord, Nashua — we are all bearing the brunt of this increase in homelessness, and it's not something we're doing wrong. It's something that the state has to wrap its arms around as well and help find immediate solutions to this, which is rapid rehousing, which is transitional housing for people to get out of shelters or out of homelessness. It's a very complex issue, but that really is probably one of the bigger issues. 

Melanie Plenda:

Beyond these stories, it seemed like there were recurring themes that hit headlines. You mentioned affordable housing and workforce development. Immigration also seemed to be a big concern throughout the year and will likely be in 2025. What stories did we see in New Hampshire? What ways might we view that topic in the news going forward? 

Carol Robidoux:

Manchester has had various groups come in as part of resettlement projects. Most recently, we had some Afghani refugees come, and interestingly one of them is a journalist, and he came with the idea that he wanted to tell some of those stories of getting grounded here in Manchester. So through working with him a little bit, we've had conversations with the International Institute of New England, and trying to really understand the relationship between the federal allocation of money and how it disappears pretty quickly, and then what that means going forward in terms of making sure that of the success for the people that are here.

And of course, we hear incidentally, especially from some [board of mayor and aldermen] members here in in Manchester, that they're part of that national narrative around immigration and refugees and sort of not wanting to be welcoming cities — the fear that we're going to become something different than we've been all along.  It's kind of correcting the thinking around what it means to be a refugee or an immigrant in 2025 in New Hampshire.

And, to be honest, there is still a lot of uncertainty, really, across the board, as far as what the national narrative is going to be. We're waiting to see what happens when President Trump enters office, and if there's continued talk about mass deportation or if that was more campaign rhetoric — we don't know, but it could really have a lot of fallout here in New Hampshire, as well as everywhere. We have a lot of families that are right now on edge. 

Gabriel Perry:

We ended up following a really quite interesting story here earlier this year, back in September. Of course, one of the main drivers of the economy here is the seasonal tourism business, and we had a prominent local business owner who was interested and sought to develop some workforce housing, essentially in a neighboring town, with the idea that he would bring in some of these visa workers who generally work for him every summer.

The town where this development was initially planned really showed a lot of opposition to the idea, and the idea eventually died. It was kind of an interesting cross-section of the discussion on immigration, sort of outside of the political context of the election and some of these other things like infrastructure and development problems that we are seeing and trying to work through here in the Lakes Region.

Melanie Plenda:

What about inflation? That also seemed to dominate headlines and the election. What sorts of things did you cover in that realm and what do you expect to look into for 2025?

Gabriel Perry:

Mostly our coverage of inflation has really kind of come in response to people describing the trouble they've had with rising costs all across the board, whether it be essentials like food and gas or, most presciently, housing. People talk a lot about the need to develop more housing because of rising rent costs, but it's not quite so simple in order for developers to have the incentives to make housing that can be priced affordably. Things along those lines have been pretty prominent in our coverage throughout the whole year, and I expect that will continue.

Carol Robidoux:

I think we're seeing a little adjustment in the housing market with the median price of a house in November was, I think, lower than it had been since about March, and sales were up a little bit. I think the rising cost of getting by is kind of what people are focused on in terms of hitting the panic button. The price of eggs is almost like a meme, but it's kind of true and we kind of see the rising cost of staples in the supermarket like that. And I feel like we need to track that for the sake of the consumer, to see what the reality is.

You have the threat of possible tariffs on things. So will the cost of doing business for builders and for construction, any industry that requires goods, imported steel — is that going to price us out of something, and is it going to have a trickle-down effect on the average citizen? 

There's a lot of uncertainty, and we don't know the answers to these things. If we had a crystal ball, it'd probably look really blurry right now, because there's just too many open-ended things. But I do think that it's a common theme you hear in casual conversation with anybody, that the cost of living has become an issue for the average person, and with tax bills reflecting the inflated price of the value of a home, it’s a good news/bad news kind of thing.

Melanie Plenda:

As you look ahead to 2025, what stories do you think will dominate New Hampshire headlines? 

Carol Robidoux:

Probably it's going to be all about all the housing that is going to be coming online. I think the last year, year and a half, two years, municipalities in the larger cities and towns have known that the housing issue is something that needed to be addressed. There was a lot of ARPA money floating around, and there's been this infusion of money to build things. Well now we’re going to see what happens with a lot of these units coming online.  Are they going to have stabilized pricing? They've been advertising apartments anywhere between $2,500 and $3,500 a month. Is that going to be sustainable, or are they going to have to reduce pricing, and is the market going to sort of level out a little bit? 

So I think just housing is really going to be everybody's big story, again. Not to be a broken record, but I think that until we fix that we're gonna be talking about it. 

Gabriel Perry:

I totally concur that housing will likely remain one of the, if not the, top story next year.

Two other things I'm looking at pretty closely are, as we roll out of winter, depending on environmental and weather conditions, is how badly lakes and rivers are affected by blooms of cyanobacteria. That is something that goes sometimes somewhat unnoticed in general, but really makes a big impact on the health and well- being and the wealth of our state. So I think that will continue to make waves as an issue.

The other thing I'm looking at is the rising cost of health care and availability of primary care physicians in multiple regions throughout the state in the context of several large hospital mergers that have occurred over the last five or six years, and even continue to occur this year. So I think those things are something that people might want to keep on their radar, absolutely.

Jack Rooney:

Locally, here in Keene and the Monadnock region, the downtown infrastructure project in Keene is going to be the big story in 2025, whether it starts on schedule or is pushed off to kind of allay some concerns of local businesses. What is the construction going to look like, and how will people be able to access downtown Keene throughout? I think those are going to be big, big questions, not just for the city of Keene, but since Keene is kind of the hub of the Monadnock Region, how is that going to have broader effects? 

Then on the on the statewide level, I think certainly the things we'll be watching very closely are the start of the Ayotte administration, as we get a new governor in New Hampshire, and kind of hand-in-hand with that is that we are heading into a budget year at the State House, and so, particularly as we discussed earlier, as a lot of the federal pandemic era spending has stopped, and especially as a second Trump administration is pledging to cut costs at the federal level, what sort of belt tightening is going to need to happen here in New Hampshire, and how much of that is going to get passed down from the state to municipalities to work that into their own local budgets?

Melanie Plenda:

Interesting predictions! Keene Sentinel managing editor for audience development Jack Rooney, Manchester Ink Link editor and publisher Carol Robidoux, and Laconia Daily Sun reporter Gabriel Perry — thank you for looking back with us.

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communications. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visit collaborativenh.org.

Winter tourism in New Hampshire: a ‘small but mighty’ economic driver

There are plenty of fun things to do in New Hampshire all year long. And when you do them, you not only entertain yourself and your friends and family, but also help the New Hampshire economy. Tourism is one of the biggest economic drivers in New Hampshire, with an estimated $1.5 billion impact on the New Hampshire economy every winter. Here to discuss that is Commissioner Taylor Caswell, who heads the Department of Business and Economic Affairs. 

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

Melanie Plenda:

How busy is the winter season for tourism in New Hampshire? How does it stack up to the other seasons in the state?

Taylor Caswell:

It's always pretty busy. We sort of have a legacy of winter tourism here in New Hampshire — it definitely has a strong following in terms of how it compares in numbers to summer and fall.

I would say of the three, it's probably the smallest in terms of the amount of dollars that we see in the amount of visits. But, it's really relevant to the fact that at that time of year, the season is a little bit shorter. Particularly as we see changes in the climate, the fall season is fast and furious. We have about four to six weeks of really vivid colors that people all over the world have on their bucket list to come see. So that's a quick one, but summer really is a long season, and in fact, it's a season that may be feeling a little bit longer. We all know that September is starting to feel like the fourth summer month. But winter is small but mighty, and it is very much, as I said, part of the legacy of New Hampshire tourism.

Melanie Plenda:

Where do most of these tourists come from?

Taylor Caswell:

Typically, within New England, we have obviously a very strong market out of the Boston and eastern Massachusetts region. But we also get into Hartford and down into New York for winter. We also see a lot of people from Maine and Canada and Vermont also checking out their fellow ski areas or their communities nearby. So we don't have a huge fly-in market. People don't generally come from Colorado to New Hampshire, but as far as the East Coast, we really, really see that as our major market.

Melanie Plenda:

Do you have any sense of why they pick New Hampshire as a destination?

Taylor Caswell:

Well, because we're so awesome, obviously. But beyond that, I think the Boston market has very easy access into New Hampshire. Obviously, we have I-93 that comes right up into the heart of our ski country, and, particularly in winter, there's a lot of family traditions and people that have been coming here for a long time.

Since COVID, we've definitely seen an increase in the number of people who have second homes, and then there's that whole Airbnb issue that exists out there. That activity, I think, has increased the number of people who are returning visitors to New Hampshire. But for the most part, I think our geography is a big reason why we see a lot of that activity from southern New England.

Melanie Plenda:

What are some of the most popular activities here in winter, and how does the state promote them? 

Taylor Caswell:

The number one activity in terms of numbers for us, pretty much every season, is snowmobiling. But, of course, that is highly dependent on the weather. Last year was not a good snowmobiling season. Skiing is right in there behind them. Skiing has the added advantage of being able to make snow, so as long as it's generally cold, they can provide a product, and people will certainly take advantage of that. Winter hiking is becoming really, really popular, and a lot of people like to do that.

I think there's a good deal of effort to try to diversify the type of activities that people have. And of course, you’ve always got the shopping and the people going into our cool downtowns, like up in Littleton and North Conway to spend an afternoon, maybe getting something to eat, a couple of good craft beers, and picking up something nice at a small Main Street store.

Melanie Plenda:

As you mentioned, skiing is one of the most popular winter activities in the state. What’s being done to grow tourism in that sector?

Taylor Caswell:

We work closely with the ski areas, particularly with Ski NH, which is their main organization. We partner with them for big events in Boston, and we support the work that they do through marketing and through joint advertising.

One of the things that we really harp on as doing quickly and very nimbly is, as you know, if it’s raining on any sort of random day in Boston, but it’s snowing in the mountains, we have to convince everybody that there’s snow up here and what they’re seeing in their backyard isn’t necessarily the reality in the ski areas. So we have done a lot of advertising, even showing live shots of snowmaking being done so people in our key markets can see that there is snow and there is winter activity happening just a few hours north.

Melanie Plenda:

As you mentioned, weather can play a role in the failure and success of so many activities. Though you can’t control Mother Nature, what can be done to foster adaptability for activities that are weather dependent?

Taylor Caswell:

Adaptation is really the name of the game — being able to provide different types of activities, being able to understand the value and the technology of snowmaking equipment, and we've seen almost all of our ski areas in New Hampshire have made some pretty big investments in that, and they're getting quite good at using it. So as long as it stays somewhere around 35 degrees and below, they can make that snow, and they're quite good at that. That provides a really, really quality product. 

Melanie Plenda:

What sort of an impact does tourism have on the New Hampshire economy, as a whole? And what are some of the key drivers of that impact?

Taylor Caswell:

Tourism is huge. I refer to it all the time as sort of the tip of the spear for economic development in New Hampshire, and it's kind of been in that role for a long time. It's our second largest industry by the number of employees and the amount of income that's generated for participants in that economy. But it also is our best advertisement.

I mean, we talk a lot about New Hampshire, generally about access to the workforce, having enough people to fill the jobs that employers have in New Hampshire. We talk a lot about being able to recruit businesses into New Hampshire to make investments and take advantage of, obviously, our business climate here. In almost all of those cases, what we are hearing and what we see and what we know is successful is the experience that people have as a tourist at one point or another here in New Hampshire, and the great quality product that our tourism industry puts forward. 

Melanie Plenda:

As you noted, when we talk about the economy, we tend to think of it as separate sectors, but in truth, so many areas are related to each other. For example, affordable housing can have an impact on the job market and, therefore, tourism. What’s being done to address some of those connected issues like affordable housing or preserving natural resources? 

Taylor Caswell:

That's a really, really important point, and it really speaks to the whole reason why this department exists. We were established in 2017 with the goal of doing exactly what you're describing — a holistic approach to our economy in New Hampshire that takes advantage of all the things that I was talking about, with tourism leading the way for a lot of the recruitment we do of not just tourists, but workforce and businesses and even students to our universities.

But the housing piece is another issue that we deal with here at the department, and the interconnectedness that that has even to tourism. You talk about people that like to come out here and work as a seasonal employee in some of our high tourist areas —those are also some of our highest-cost areas as far as housing goes. How do we address that?

I mentioned earlier the Airbnb issue. That's a significant issue in a lot of our sort of tourism economy communities up in the Mount Washington Valley, for example.  That's an issue that they've really been struggling with — a lot of people in in more urban areas find it quite affordable to buy a nice little home in North Conway and then maybe just Airbnb that when they're not there — perfectly legitimate business, but at the same time, that takes away a housing unit that might typically be used for someone who's working at one of those ski areas during the winter. So it is an ongoing challenge. It's one of those things where you squeeze the balloon in one place and it pops up on another, but we continue to use the sort of resources we have here at the Department of Business and Economic Affairs to understand how those pieces go together and try to help do something about it for our communities. 

Melanie Plenda:

What else is being done to grow tourism in New Hampshire? What are the challenges there and what are the opportunities? 

Taylor Caswell:

Challenges are always obviously the broader economy, and how much disposable income people have for travel — cost of gas is something that always comes up in that in that consideration, inflation, all the general costs that go into planning a trip. We are, in some respects, slaves to those types of economics. A couple of years ago during COVID and the border to Canada was closed, we definitely saw a decrease in the numbers, particularly obviously coming out of Canada, but our overall numbers were affected by that.

When we look into the crystal ball here of what's going to happen over the next couple of years, those are the types of things that we really need to be paying attention to and trying to accommodate. Those costs, again, are something that the state government is not going to necessarily have control over, but we can work with our industry to make sure that they're pricing themselves in a way that's highly competitive for the market that we're in.

Melanie Plenda:

What’s your prediction for the outlook for tourism in New Hampshire this winter? How do you think things will go?

Taylor Caswell:

We see each year the ability for our tourism industry to take advantage of a very close market, still with some disposable income to come up and really experience the state. The only thing that really holds us back, ultimately, is the weather. But I always try to be very optimistic — particularly when I’m in a format like this.

Melanie Plenda:

Business and Economic Affairs Commissioner Taylor Caswell — thank you for joining us today. 

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communications. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. For more information, visit collaborativenh.org. These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative.

The ski industry’s continued impact on New Hampshire’s economy

For most of us, the snow isn’t here yet. However, the skiing season has begun. As one of the largest economic drivers in the state, the ski industry affects every New Hampshire resident. Every year about 2.8 million people visit the ski areas of New Hampshire — and most of those people come from out of state. They spend an estimated $384 million, generating thousands of jobs and hundreds of millions more in economic impact. That’s why the winter season is an important one for the state, especially for the northern and western areas. On this episode of “The State We’re In,” host Melanie Plenda talks with Jessyca Keeler, president of Ski New Hampshire about the outlook for the season and what’s new in New Hampshire ski areas.

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity. 

Melanie Plenda:

Please tell our audience more about Ski New Hampshire. As an organization, what do you do and whom do you serve? 

Jessyca Keeler:

We are a nonprofit 501(c)(6) trade association that represents ski areas from around the state of New Hampshire. We currently have over 30 members. We also work with a host of associate members that are kind of adjacent to the ski industry.

We have three or four different buckets, if you will, of activities. One of those is advocacy and government relations work. We also do a lot of educational programming and planning for our members and offer networking opportunities as well. Then we do some marketing and PR and communications work.

Melanie Plenda:

In a general sense, what is the outlook for the 2024-2025 ski season this year? How does the weather look? How many people are expected? 

Jessyca Keeler:

We're always an optimistic bunch in the ski industry. While I'm not a meteorologist, one thing I will note is that this is apparently a La Nina year in terms of global climate phenomena or patterns. What that means, at least what we've read or been told that that means, is that we could be looking at a colder winter than average. Precipitation could be higher, could be lower. We could be seeing more storms. But honestly, time will tell.
We’re excited about the pattern that we're currently in. It's gotten colder in the last week or so. We've had a couple snow events. So we're excited about that. In terms of how many people are expected to come, I mean that really depends a lot on the weather. As much as ski areas do a lot of work to prepare for the winter and make sure that we have a great skiing surface and experience for people, the weather really can dictate how many people come in any given season. But, over the last 10 years, we've been averaging approximately 2.3 million skiers, which would be Alpine, cross-country and tubing visitors, over the course of each winter. So hopefully, we'll be in that range. 

Melanie Plenda:

For our audience, tell us more about the direct and perhaps indirect impact that skiing has on the New Hampshire economy. What businesses and industries are affected? What kind of revenue does it generate? 

Jessyca Keeler:

The last economic impact study we did was about six years ago, and what we were looking at was about $384 million in direct and indirect spending by skiers. That's spending at ski areas but also spending at places like restaurants and lodging properties and grocery stores and gas stations. But then you look at the induced effect, which really brings that number up to about a 500-plus-million-dollar economic impact to the state of New Hampshire. So that means that you're taking the employees who work in those businesses, whether it's the ski areas or the lodging properties or the restaurants, and they are then spending their funds, their income, if you will, on rentals or homes. They're paying taxes, going to the same grocery stores and gas stations that guests are going to, and they're just generally contributing back to the economy. So overall, we're looking at about a half a billion dollars a year. That number may have grown or changed since the study was completed in early 2019, but that's roughly the economic impact.

Overall, we're looking at communities in generally rural and mountainous parts of the state that rely heavily on tourism. So that's, you know, a lot of those communities, the ski area is kind of the big attraction — the big driver, the big economic driver for those areas. So without those ski areas, a lot of those other businesses might not do so well. It's an important economic driver for a lot of parts of the state.

Melanie Plenda:

It looks like many ski areas upgraded facilities over the summer, especially in terms of snow-producing equipment. Can you tell us more about that? 

Jessyca Keeler:

Ski areas are constantly investing in snowmaking. This is something that's been going on for decades, really. When the ski industry started back in the 1930s in the state, it was pretty evident right away that we might need some help along the way, because Mother Nature can be kind of fickle in the winters here in New England and in New Hampshire. 

It's really just important and vital for ski areas to invest in that technology so that we can guarantee a great product for skiers and riders who are coming up here to ensure that our winter tourism industry is healthy. So it's something that we do on a regular basis. I think this year alone, at least eight ski areas that I've counted that I know of invested — some small investments, some really big investments — in snowmaking this year, and I expect that to continue in the years to come.

Melanie Plenda:

How is climate change affecting the industry?

Jessyca Keeler:

It's definitely something that we've been grappling with over the years. We are seeing warming winters. Winters seem to start a little bit later. It takes a while for the weather to get cold enough to make snow, or for us to start seeing snowfall, or the ground freezing. This time of year, ski areas are sometimes opening later than they planned, maybe by a week or so. We're seeing that on the other end as well, in the spring. So we might be having warmer springs happening earlier than we expect, and that has caused some ski areas to close earlier than planned.

Likewise, with the extreme weather events that we're seeing. Last year, in December, we had this big rain and flooding event that kind of caused us to lose a lot of the snowmaking gains that we had right before the holidays. That really had an impact on us. Then in the spring, we saw some crazy storms where a lot of heavy snow fell, and in some places it was so heavy that it was either more icy or it was so heavy that it brought down trees, which caused power outages. Then ski areas can't over operate in those regions.

So it's definitely having an impact on our industry, but we're pretty resilient, and we have been taking strides and making efforts over the years to try and deal with what comes our way.

Melanie Plenda:

What’s being done to mitigate that impact? 

Jessyca Keeler:

Investments in snowmaking are a really important part of that adaptation for us as an industry, and ski areas are constantly reinvesting in that. Other investments include grooming technology as well — better groomers. There's a lot of work done on the slopes during the summer months to prepare for a season so that you can have less snow on the trails, for example. There’s a lot of different things that ski areas are doing to adapt.

Melanie Plenda:

Your organization also gathers skiing deals. Can you tell us more about those? Are there still discounts, and how regularly is that updated? And when’s the best time to get a deal?

Jessyca Keeler:

So it really depends on what kind of deal you're looking for. If you're a season pass holder — if you know you're going to ski more than, say, five times in a winter and you know you want to go to either the same mountain or different mountains — we do provide information about different season passes. I find that the best time to buy those is usually in the spring, when season one is still going. So if you're skiing in March, you might start to see ski areas advertising to you for the best rates for next season. If you're pretty sure that you're going to ski next season, I would recommend that you get your passes in the spring. It's usually like April, May, maybe into June, it varies by ski area, but those are the best times to get a pass. 

Melanie Plenda:

What does the future look like for skiing in New Hampshire?

Jessyca Keeler:

Like I said, we're optimists, and I would say I fall into that category as well. The ski areas, based on the investments that they've been making at their properties — we're not just talking about snowmaking, we're talking about new lodges, new trails, new mountains, even added to some of the existing ski resorts. We’re just seeing a lot of investment, and I think that points to a healthy industry. The future is bright. With those snowmaking and snow grooming investments that we've made, I think that we're prepared to deal with whatever comes our way. 

Melanie Plenda:

Well, good luck with the season. Jessyca Keeler, president of Ski New Hampshire, thank you for joining us today. 

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communications. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members.These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visitcollaborativenh.org

New Hampshire’s growing hunger problem and ways to relieve it

For many, Thanksgiving is an epic feast, featuring a table full of food. But for some, full tables aren’t always a reality. Feeding America, a nationwide network of food banks, food pantries and local meal programs, released its “Map the Meal Gap 2024” report earlier this year, and it noted that more than 135,200 New Hampshire residents are food-insecure — a year-over-year increase of more than 41,000 people. In total, about 10 percent of New Hampshire residents — and more than 13 percent of children — are food insecure, meaning they don’t know where their next meal is coming from. Several organizations in the state are doing what they can to address hunger locally. On this episode of “The State We’re In,” Jenn Morton, of End 68 Hours of Hunger-Nashua and Anne Hayes of Gather talk with host Melanie Plenda on the problems and solutions. 

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been lightly edited for length and clarity.

Melanie Plenda:

First, Jenn and Anne, please tell our audience about your organizations and how they are addressing food insecurity and hunger in New Hampshire.

Jenn Morton:

End 68 Hours of Hunger focuses on feeding children who face food insecurity at home. There are End 68 Hours of Hunger programs throughout the state. Ours in Nashua distributes food bags to about 17 schools and community centers locally, and we are currently feeding approximately 480 children a week. 

Anne Hayes:

We're a broad spectrum organization. Our mission is to offer innovative programs that build food security in welcoming and dignified ways, and it ranges from a bricks-and-mortar food pantry here in Portsmouth to mobile markets. We run about 40 mobile markets every month going out on the seacoast from all the way down to Seabrook and all the way  up to Somersworth and Farmington.

We also do a lot of food repurposing. We take food that would otherwise go to waste and turn it into meals and distribute about 80,000 of those meals every year, and another 1.7 million pounds of food every year to about 10,000-plus New Hampshire residents and York County, Maine, residents every month.

Melanie Plenda:

Anne, what does food insecurity and hunger look like in New Hampshire? 

Anne Hayes:

If I were to go out this morning in front of our food pantry, there would be about 30 people waiting in line, and it's all ages. It's people who are unhoused. It's seniors on fixed incomes that have felt the pinch of increases in food prices and housing prices. It's families with small children. There was a man in our pantry today with his little two-year-old in the cart. It's a huge range of people, from individuals all the way up to families with eight people in them. It's hard to say what it looks like, because you'd be really surprised at what it looks like.

Melanie Plenda:

Jenn, how big of a problem is this? 

Jenn Morton:

I think food insecurity is kind of a hidden problem in New Hampshire and across the nation. It's something that people don't always want to admit to or talk about.

We often get children that were identified at schools for behavioral reasons. It's not that they come in saying that they're hungry, but they'll come in really tired, and when the teacher asks about how their night was, they will admit to not sleeping so well. And when they ask more about why they didn't sleep so well, it turns out they didn't have dinner the night before, so they went to bed hungry. Food insecurity and hunger doesn't always present as someone saying, “I need food.” It can be an invisible problem that especially children aren't really tuned in to. We have children who are worried or nervous about going home on Fridays because they don't know where their next meal is coming from, and that's where our bags come in. They go home with the children for the weekend so that they know that they can have a source of food while they're at home.

Melanie Plenda:

There was a rise in the number of food-insecure people in New Hampshire last year. What’s fueling that? 

Anne Hayes:

Back in 2020, when the pandemic hit, things went up a lot. We all thought that it would come back down when the pandemic ended, but I think what's happened is, with food prices going up, with housing prices going up, with the end of pandemic era benefits, people are really finding themselves super squeezed. They may have been able to set aside a little bit of money earlier on when those benefits ended, but now that money is gone, and they are forced to come and access a food pantry, which we think is actually a really good idea for people. We love to see people come here first before they end up not being able to pay their rent, not being able to keep their car on the road so they can go to work, those kinds of things. But what we're really seeing is that people are just really being squeezed by the cost of living.

Jenn Morton:

Unfortunately, pay scales have not kept up with the cost of living, especially in New Hampshire. Minimum wage jobs or jobs that are barely making a living wage, maybe $12, $14, $15 an hour is not going to pay rent for a family of four. So there aren’t as many agencies that can help with rent or utility bills, but there are lots of agencies that can help with food. We’re always glad when families are able to reach out and say, “I’m really just struggling this month.” We see it throughout the school year. Our numbers increase in September, October. People just hear about our program, they're like, “No, I'm OK. I can get through this right now.” But when we really see a spike in our bag numbers is January, February, March, when people are deciding whether to pay their utility bills for heat and hot water through the winter, or whether they're deciding to put food on their table. That is especially when our bag numbers get really high, and we're glad that they have a resource to reach out to fill that gap.

Melanie Plenda:

As a community, in your opinion, are we doing enough to ensure everyone has enough to eat? 

Anne Hayes:

I think the community is very supportive of Gather’s work and of the work of other organizations like us. I feel like we have a very, very generous community, both in terms of people who donate money and in terms of people who give their time to help.

I think on the state level, there's more that we could be doing. There's more we could be doing to make sure that people who are eligible are on SNAP. There's more we could be doing by providing breakfast before the bell for students in schools, making it easier to sign up for free and reduced price lunch at schools for children, making it easier for seniors. We did get some legislation passed this year that made it easier for seniors to sign up for SNAP [the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program], and that was great, but there's more to be done. 

Jenn Morton:

There were actually several bills in the Legislature last spring that would have expanded the free and reduced lunch program for students. Currently, there are not as many families qualifying for student free and reduced lunch as needed. It's based on the federal poverty income level, and we've definitely been able to expand other programs based on the federal poverty level, such as the Education Freedom Account program. We're giving out money for private schools, and yet we're not feeding the children who need to be there to eat.  So there's definitely ways that we need to support better at the state level.

But, as Anne said, our communities are really pitching in. No one wants to see children hungry in their communities. That has been my takeaway from my eight years volunteering here. We have a lot of volunteers that show up for any event that we plan. We do get a good amount of financial support, but at the state level and federally, there's definitely more to be done. I would love to see a statewide free breakfast and lunch program for students.

Melanie Plenda:

Along those same lines, what can we do? Is there a solution to this problem? 

Jenn Morton:

Definitely. Advocate, advocate, advocate for hunger solutions in your community. Pitch in and volunteer at your local level, but reach out to your state representatives, let them know that you care about the fact that there are hungry people in your community. We can work funding into the budget if that's something that we choose to prioritize. So I definitely encourage anyone to advocate for people, and that would be a great help. Also, local donations — both of actual food goods or monetary donations — are always appreciated to any of your local nonprofit food banks and food pantries,

Anna Hayes:

On the state level, reaching out to your state reps makes a big difference. The Hunger Free NH bill  [in the last legislative session] that we had was pretty much gutted, unfortunately, — there was a lot in there that could have really helped people. I think the more people who reach out and say something to their reps, the more likely it is that people start to recognize the problem.

Beyond that, I would say, definitely, Gather has a ton of volunteer opportunities. We work with between 40 and 50 volunteers every day to distribute the food that we distribute, and we would love to have more support in that way .And donating, because in the end in New Hampshire, more of the weight of this problem falls on nonprofits. So anything you can do to donate your time, talent or treasure is greatly appreciated. 

Melanie Plenda:

How can people help you with your work? What’s the best way to contribute?

Anne Hayes:

We can always use funding to support our work. If you go to our website, at gathernh,org,we would appreciate any contributions that people can make. Also on our website is a button that says “volunteer.” We would love to have people sign up to do that. And then just really helping by reaching out to state reps, reaching out to your neighbors, seeing if you can organize a food drive — participating in those kinds of things really makes a difference for us.

Jenn Morton:

Same here. Our website, end68hoursofhunger.org our website has your local communities listed that have End 68 Hours of Hunger programs. Most of them have buttons to give directly to your local community. Quite a few of them also have buttons to local volunteer opportunities. We also have an Amazon wish list at End 68 Hours of Hunger in Nashua. So all you have to do is visit that website, click through a wish list or a donate button, and you can really make a big difference in the life of a child in your community by helping to end their hunger situation, we really appreciate it.

Melanie Plenda:

Thank you Jenn Morton from End 68 Hours of Hunger-Nashua and Anne Hayes from Gather for discussing this really important topic today. 

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communications. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. These articles are shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative as part of our Race and Equity Initiative. For more information visit collaborativenh.org. 

Beyond the ballot: Understanding the election’s impact

For the last few months, we’ve all been caught up in the election campaigns at both the state and federal levels. But now the election is over, and we know who won and who lost. But what do the results mean and what can we expect in the coming months? Joining us on this episode of “The State We’re In,” are veteran reporter Ethan DeWitt of the New Hampshire Bulletin and Anna Brown, executive director of Citizens Count, and executive director of the Warren B. Rudman Center for Justice, Leadership, and Public Service at the University of New Hampshire’s Franklin Pierce School of Law.

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

Melanie Plenda:

First, let’s talk about the election results. As veterans of New Hampshire politics, were you surprised by the results?

Ethan DeWitt:

To be honest, not really. I think when you look at the top of the ticket results, the challenge for Kelly Ayotte was to outperform Kamala Harris. Polls were showing that Kamala Harris had an advantage, as Democrats have in this state since 2000 in the presidential race. But as we've seen from Governor Sununu, simply because the state elects a Democrat for president doesn't mean that they won't elect a Republican for governor. 

So at the top of the ticket, I was not too surprised. In terms of the legislative races. I think that they largely followed the top of the ticket in some ways, but also I think the House we've seen realigns itself to how it has looked in past cycles. None of this kind of one- or two-vote advantage, but a more sizable majority for the Republican Party.

Anna Brown:

Like Ethan, I wasn't surprised by these election results in New Hampshire. I think the last poll that I saw the day before the election was very telling. It showed that about 10% of voters who had voted for Biden in the last election cycle were planning on voting for Kelly Ayotte for governor. That's very consistent with New Hampshire's recent history and even longer history of ticket-splitting. It is also worth noting that in the Executive Council and Senate, the way the districts are drawn, it's very hard for Democrats to win in a majority of these districts. So going in, I was already sort of expecting the votes to go that way. I think the House of Representatives ultimately can be the least predictable and oftentimes, for me, the most interesting results. That's really where we really did see that Republican advantage in New Hampshire, which I think was probably driven by their anti-tax messaging that, once again, was sort of Kelly Ayotte coattails.

Melanie Plenda:

Anna, you and your organization have been surveying voters. Why do you think voters made the choices they did? 

Anna Brown:

As I mentioned in the New Hampshire state races, tax and budget issues are really what end up, I think, driving a lot of voters to the polls. Other issues — such as the abortion issue, for example —I think have played out in previous elections. But the Republican candidates in New Hampshire had a very unified message this time — that we are not looking to change New Hampshire abortion law as it currently stands. That obviously resonated with voters.

I think Joyce Craig and other Democrats were pointing out Kelly Ayotte's history with certain corporate boards and saying we should be taxing the rich and looking at the interest and dividends tax maybe. That did not ultimately succeed with voters. I think that Kelly Ayotte's message of ‘don't mess up New Hampshire’, was a very successful message. So I think that the Democrats sort of failed to rally around a clear issue that resonated with voters in the same way as the simplistic message that the Republicans really hit a home run with.

Melanie Plenda:

Several state races were also decided. Let’s talk about the Executive Council first. Anna, first, explain what the council does and then tell us your thoughts? 

Anna Brown:

The New Hampshire Executive Council is uniquely powerful in the United States. They approve governor-appointed contracts over $10,000, so the governor actually kind of needs to have the Executive Council on their side to implement their vision for state government for all of those appointments, including judicial appointments. We know that state courts, state supreme courts, in particular, are going to become increasingly important as the U.S. Supreme Court is sending issues back to the states, such as the abortion issue. So I think that the Executive Council is going to definitely be an ally to Governor Ayotte. We've had a 4-1 Republican majority, and I'm not expecting any great battles there. 

Melanie Plenda:

Next, let’s talk about the state senate. Republicans expanded their majority there. What does that mean for the next cycle?

Ethan DeWitt:

Again, this expanded from a 14/-10 Republican advantage to a 16-8 Republican advantage. That is a veto-proof majority. I'm unsure at the moment what issues there might be in which a Republican Senate would want to override a veto by a Governor-elect Ayotte. But that is the most apparent transformation of the Senate.

Other than that, I think it’s, just like with the council, going to give her a lot of padding. Especially with the House, which has traditionally leaned more libertarian, and that has caused problems for more moderate Republicans like Governor Sununu. Sununu throughout his time as governor, kind of used the Senate as sort of a backstop to some of the budgets that the House would put forward. Because the House gets to draft a budget before the Senate does, and the House drafted something that's deemed too conservative, he, would call on the Senate to kind of “fix it.” So this might be a tool for Ayotte, especially with the wide majorities now in the Senate. She may be able to use that, but it kind of depends on how the Senate is run.

Melanie Plenda:

Republicans also expanded their majority in the House of Representatives. What impact will that have?

Anna Brown:

I think that the biggest impact this will have is on a few issues that Republicans tried to get over the finish line last year and the year before  and didn't quite have the votes with that very tight Democrat-Republican split.

Probably the first one that leapt to mind, as soon as I saw the results come in, was some version of a parental bill of rights. There were many versions of those bills, but basically, think about — What do schools have to disclose to parents? What do schools have to get permission from parents, whether we're talking about student pronoun use, student names, books in the classroom, books in the library, different curriculum choices. So what exact form does that bill take? Yet to be seen, but it’s absolutely an issue that many Republicans are passionate about,

Ethan DeWitt:

I have heard from top Republicans that there is a bill that was filed ahead of the election that got a lot of attention. It would create a deportation task force in the state. The bill does not define that, because we don't have the text of the bill, but I've already heard from top Republicans who are also in leadership, who say they don't support that. So I think that's going to be an interesting wedge issue. 

The other thing I would point to with this increased majority, in addition to the parental Bill of Rights, is an expansion of Education Freedom Accounts. There was a push, including by Governor-elect Ayotte, to try to make those universal. But again, that comes against the backdrop of this budget and potentially having to tighten it. If you make that program universal, then the budget for that program could, theoretically, increase quite a lot.

I think that looking at the budget generally is going to be really interesting to see. When you looked at the budget two years ago under a very, very closely divided almost 200-200 House The majority Republicans did something I thought was pretty remarkable and surprising. They decided to cut a deal with Democrats. Despite a lot of them having come up the ranks from the libertarian side, including House Majority Leader Jason Osborne, they cut a deal with Democrats. A lot of the people on their side didn't like that. Now they've got a lot more security in numbers and they will try to forge ahead with a more conservative budget.

Melanie Plenda:

Now that these elections are over, things will be gearing up soon for the next election in New Hampshire, which is related to Town Meeting. These elections don’t get the same turnout, but they can have a big impact on voters’ lives. Ethan and Anna, explain why these matter and what you’ll be following. 

Ethan DeWitt:

Obviously this is the most local format to make your voice known when it comes to your own town's budget, so town meeting season is always important.

I think a few things will be interesting. There is a new voting law that will be in place that requires voter ID. There is also a new law that requires that there be accessible voting machines provided by the state to towns. I think that will be in place as well. I think that there will be some questions about special education funding. I've heard this week that the Department of Education sent out a letter to school districts saying that this state is facing a shortfall of special education funding and that towns will have to make up more of that budget expense, and I think that'll be interesting to watch as it pertains to school district budgets.

Anna Brown:

I was actually already going to be watching special education funding- related issues because we saw that to be a real problem in some towns and districts this past year as well, because the number of students in these programs has been increasing and some of that also carries increased staff costs. We've also seen health care costs for schools go up quite a bit. So Pembroke, for example, I know, had almost a crisis situation with their school funding at their local meetings last year.

So if you're in a tough budget year as well, there's going to be a lag before the state implements its budget changes, and those would filter down to the local level. But I wouldn't be surprised if those conversations do happen at the local level already, because all of these problems are going to be compounded going forward, and we haven’t talked about what’s going on with school-funding lawsuits in the state. That’s another big question mark.

Melanie Plenda:

That was fascinating. Thanks to veteran reporter Ethan DeWitt from the New Hampshire Bulletin and Anna Brown, executive director of Citizens Count, for sharing your thoughts.

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communications. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visit collaborativenh.org

Bridging the divide: Tackling America's post-election ‘perception gap’

The 2024 presidential election results are in, and it seems like Americans are more polarized than ever. For years, we’ve seemed to live in an increasingly polarized society of Democrats and Republicans, red states and blue states, liberals and conservatives. But how divided is our society? And is that perception truly the reality? On this episode of “The State We’re In,” More in Common Executive Director Jason Mangone discusses the organization’s research into the “perception gap” and its efforts to unite increasingly divided societies. 

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

Rosemary Ford:

First, tell us more about More in Common, and what you do. 

Jason Mangone:

More in Common is a nonpartisan research organization that tries to reduce the harmful aspects of polarization. That means that we try to understand the forces driving us apart, see common ground and bring Americans together to tackle our shared challenges as a practical matter. That means we release dozens of studies and polls every year, and the punchline of a lot of our work is sort of in the name. We think that Americans have way more in common than we think we do.

Rosemary Ford:

Tell us about the perception gap study. How did that come about? How was it conducted? 

Jason Mangone:

To begin with, it's probably worth defining what we mean by perception gap. So a perception gap is the difference between what someone thinks their political opponent feels about an issue and what their political opponent actually feels about an issue. It’s implicit in the idea that we have more in common than we think we do. There's some sort of fundamental misunderstanding going on that we don't really get one another — particularly in the arena of politics. That's because we think politics is a really poor lens for understanding someone in general. 

We wanted to look into these ideas, which is sort of the inspiration study. We released our first perception gap study in 2019, and we've been releasing various perception gaps ever since. To give an example of how we conduct these studies, let's say that we wanted to gauge Democrats' perception gaps on a particular issue. We begin by asking thousands of Republicans whether they agree with something. So, for example, we've asked thousands of Republicans, “Do you agree that Americans have a responsibility to learn from our past and fix our mistakes?” Turns out, about 93% of Republicans agree with this statement. We then asked thousands of Democrats, “What percentage of Republicans do you think agree with that statement?” It turns out that all Democrats estimate that only about 35% of Republicans would agree with the statement. That means that, on the issue, “Do you agree that Americans have a responsibility to learn from our past and fix their mistakes?” there's a 58% perception gap — 93% of Republicans agree with that statement, but only 35% of Democrats think Republicans would agree with that.

Rosemary Ford:

What were the key findings of the study? 

Jason Mangone:

One in particular, I think, is the idea of patriotism, love of country and understanding of our history that's been cycling through our politics for the last eight or 10 years. I think there's a stereotype where we think that Republicans think that American history is perfect, that we've done no wrong, and we stereotype Democrats as classifying our entire history as sort of sinful. 

I've already highlighted an example of the Democrat perception gap here, but Republicans estimate that only 45% of Democrats agree with this statement. In other words, we think that our political opponents either love our history and our country blindly, or they want to dismiss our history completely. In truth, an overwhelming majority of Americans agree with the idea that our country has both achieved great things and also made some harmful mistakes along the way, and that both of these things are true at the same time. So all that is to say, our ideas of our sense of history and our ideas of patriotism are much more aligned than we think they are. We have a ton of perception gaps. 

In addition to the idea of patriotism, I also wanted to highlight one around immigration. It turns out that over 85% of Republicans agree that properly controlled immigration can be good for America. Democrats estimate that only around half of Republicans agree with this statement, so they underestimated by about 35%. On the same issue, around 75% of Democrats disagree with the idea that we should have open borders, but Republicans estimate that only around 40% of Democrats hold this view, meaning there's a 35% perception gap.

All that is to say, as it turns out, is that most Americans want a secure system of legalized immigration and most Americans want both order and compassion for immigrants. Obviously, that's not how we talk about it in the political arena.

Rosemary Ford:

How expected were these findings? 

Jason Mangone:

We knew that there would be gaps in people's understanding, particularly when the lens through which you're looking at those gaps is politics. We do a really, really bad job of understanding who people are and who are political opponents. So that wasn't altogether surprising. 

What was most surprising to me was some of the drivers of these gaps. Anytime that More in Common does a study, we break the American population down into seven segments that we think are much more representative about how people view themselves in the world than sheer red or blue demography. The farthest left and the farthest right are referred to as the wings.Those groups in the middle are referred to as the exhausted majority. So it goes from progressive activists, traditional liberals, passive liberals, the politically disengaged, the moderates, traditional conservatives and devoted conservatives.

The most surprising thing to me, pretty much, anytime we do a perception gap study is that if you look at the rates of perception gaps, it's almost a perfect V shape, which is to say the perception gaps are perception gaps are greatest among those people on the wings of politics, and they’re lowest among the politically disengaged, right in the middle. The surprising thing there is that the people that are the most politically disengaged have the best understanding of what their political opponents actually think about various political issues.

Rosemary Ford:

What role is social media playing in all of this? How does that influence the perception gap or influence it?

Jason Mangone:

First off, I never like to come across as completely anti-social media. I think that it's given people freedom to express ideas, which is vital and important. I also think that it's a relatively new technology, and we're figuring out how to fit it in to our day-to-day lives right now.

With that being said, when it comes to politics, most of the algorithms in social media are driven by engagement, and the most engaging content tends to be divisive. It's also true that the people who are likely to share political views on social media are progressive activists on one wing and devoted conservatives on the other. So I wouldn't say that it's entirely social media's fault. I would say that progressive activists and devoted conservatives tend to be the most active on social media. Those algorithms tend to highlight the most divisive views because they tend to be the most engaging. It's what we want to consume.

As a result, a lot of our political discourse becomes driven by people on the wings. I think the important distinction there is that it's not entirely the social media companies’ fault. A lot of it is who's actually willing to get out there and share political views on social media. It turns out that it’s the people who are most politically engaged, who frame things primarily through the lens of politics, and those people in general tend to be people on the wings.

Rosemary Ford:

Why should the average person be concerned about the perception gap? 

Jason Mangone:

I think it's really a call to have some political humility. Don't think about people as entirely political animals. One of the implicit ideas in perception gaps is that you could look at perception gaps between any two out groups — Democrats-Republicans, Yankees fans-Red Sox fans, and I'm sure that there are misunderstandings among a lot of them. The point is that when we look at things through a primarily political lens, we tend to misunderstand, because politics is a really, really bad lens for understanding a human being. I think how the average person should react to it and why they should be concerned by it is that, because politics shapes so much of our culture and so much of how we think about ourselves nowadays, it's a call that we're really misunderstanding one another.

Rosemary Ford:

In light of the election, what do you expect to see with the perception gap?

Jason Mangone:

I will caveat what I’m about to say by saying that we have a poll hitting the field where we ask a number of perception gap questions, because whatever is in the media tends to have the highest perception gaps. I would guess that the largest perception gaps are going to be around issues associated with the biggest news, and today it's the fact that former President Trump won not just the Electoral College, but the national popular vote. So I would imagine that the largest perception gaps will be around people's perspectives on Trump, not just as a political figure, but as a human being. 

Rosemary Ford:

Do you have suggestions for bridging this divide? 

Jason Mangone:

I'll start with what the worst idea is. The worst idea is to say, “We're going to get a bunch of us together and we're going to talk about politics, because we all disagree with each other.” We need to talk, that's fine, but an example is the holidays. Around my dinner table, around the holidays, there's some Trump voters and there's some Harris voters, there's some Republicans, there's some Democrats, there's some upper-middle-class folks, there's some working-class folks. We don't go to that holiday dinner saying, “We're gonna get together and talk about our political differences.” No, we get together because we're a family. We share our common values and traditions, and the food's really good, and all the other stuff might come up as a result. But the point is, we see one another in our common humanity, because the thing that got us there is much more important than sheer demography that's ultimately colored blue or red. 

So that's a really long way of saying, get involved in your community in ways that have nothing to do with politics. Join a club, join the board of your local Little League, become a volunteer firefighter — there's a million things that you can do. But the point is, get together, where people across the political spectrum might be getting together for reasons that have nothing to do with politics.

Rosemary Ford:

Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this. 

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communications. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visit collaborativenh.org.

Survey reliability: How much do polls affect elections?

With the 2024 election behind us, the seemingly daily reports on new polls have ended for now. But what do polls really mean? How accurate are they? What impact do they have on voters and elections? University of New Hampshire Professor Andrew Smith, director of the UNH Survey Center, talks with host Melanie Plenda about just that.

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

Melanie Plenda:

Where do polls come from and how long have we been using them to analyze political races?

Dr. Andrew Smith:

Polls have been around for an awfully long time. The oldest one that we've been able to identify in the United States is in the 1824 election. They were referred to as straw polls back then, but they were started by a newspaper, the Harrisburg Pennsylvanian, and it was done to, frankly, increase the number of people who bought the newspaper at that time and to help inform readers as to what people in the Harrisburg, area thought about the 1824 election. Throughout the 1800s, we saw an expansion of these, particularly in the later half of the 1800s as the penny press really developed in the United States.

By the turn of the century, there were quite a few national straw polls and well over 100 individual local area straw polls. So it's not a new thing, but it's really important to remember that the reason that the media got into the polling business was to sell newspapers. I think that's a critical thing to remember, because the reason that sells more newspapers is that people are always interested in what is going to happen. I think it sold newspapers then, and it's kind of clickbait for the press now to run polls. 

Melanie Plenda:

That leads to my next question – what sort of an impact do they have on races and voters? 

Dr. Andrew Smith:

There's very little research that shows that polls have much of an impact one way or the other on elections. There's always a fear that a poll showing one candidate leading by a large amount will either lead the supporters of a candidate who's losing supporters to give up and stay home, or maybe cause the supporters of a candidate who's leading to say that they have already won and don't have to bother to go to the polls. But there's very, very little evidence that supports any of that.

The only real data that I've been able to identify that shows that polls had an impact was in the 1980 presidential election. What happened that year was that the exit polls were released early. This was the Carter v. Reagan election, and Jimmy Carter actually conceded defeat before the polls in California closed, and some Democratic congressmen in California asserted that they lost because many people that were going to go vote after work decided, “What’s the point? The election is already over.” So that's really the only evidence that we have. 

Melanie Plenda:

How has polling evolved in the past decades? I would imagine technology and changing social demographics have changed things.

Dr. Andrew Smith:

The polling industry is in the midst of a paradigm shift, and it's similar to what happened in the 1960s and 1970s, when polls moved from in-person surveys to telephone surveys. The technology for telephones improved, the coverage of telephones improved, so most households in the country had a telephone by the late 1960s. But it took a long time for researchers to come up with the best practices, the methodological strategies, in order to use this new technology. 

It's important to remember that the big driver of that methodological change in the 1960s and 1970s telephone surveys was the cost, because in-person surveys were an order of magnitude more expensive than telephone surveys and  harder to manage, and then organizing the data and analyzing it. So the time frame was worse. Telephones made that much shorter. 

Now, with web surveys and the development of the internet and the expansion of coverage of the internet to most households in the country or the internet plus a cell phone — we can kind of call that the quasi-internet — we changed how we can go at people because of the cost. It costs far less with an internet- or a web-based poll, because you don't have to have an interviewer. We're seeing the industry move to that, and the clients as well. The development of the internet, the development of cell phones, and the declining response rates, I think, are the biggest drivers of this change in methodology. 

So we're in this process where economics are driving us to change the way we do survey research, and we haven't developed the best practices as an industry yet to say this is how you should do it, this is the more accurate way, these are the procedures that lead to more accurate predictions in polling, and it's going to take several years before we're out of the woods with that. So I'm very cautious about it.

Melanie Plenda:

Let’s dig a little deeper. How can the average person tell a “good” from a “bad” poll?

Dr. Andrew Smith:

The human instinct is to trust the polls that show us the outcome that we prefer and say that the other one must have serious methodological flaws. But I think that's a bad way to approach it.

What I would trust is surveys more that start with a random sample — a probability-based survey. So if you see the word “probability” in the methodology section of the survey, which I would encourage everybody to read, I’d give that more weight.  If it makes no mention of probability, that probably means that there is no random sampling going on. 

The second thing that I would do is look for something called a transparency initiative stamp, or a logo on that survey, or an indication that this organization is showing their work. APOR, the  American Association of Public Opinion Research, recognizes that there are a lot of different methodologies out there and asks, “The best thing we can do is ask survey research to show us what they did. How did they draw their sample? Where did they get the sample from? How were the surveys collected? When were the surveys collected? Who's paying for the surveys?” All of those sorts of things you need to take into account.  If a survey does not have that transparency initiative seal approval, I would be less willing to accept the results of that because it shows they are less willing to show their work. 

Melanie Plenda:

So talk to us a little bit more about why a sample group and the makeup of that sample group is so important.

Dr. Andrew Smith:

Well, what we try to do in surveys is draw a sample from the population that is representative of the population. And by doing that at random, we can use the central limit theorem to say that the estimates that we get from our sample are within this range of where the actual population number would be if we could go out and interview everyone in the population. Even with a random sample, you don't necessarily have one that's completely representative of the population. In fact, it's pretty much impossible to do that, but you want to be pretty close, and the central limit theorem at least allows us to say within a range of how close we think our estimate is from the overall population. 

Melanie Plenda:

That’s fascinating. Thank you for joining us and talking about the polls.

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communications. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visit collaborativenh.org.

How to learn about local candidates for office, the people who can impact you directly

While national or statewide candidates get lots of coverage, and voters likely know their stances on the issues, local candidates are often unfamiliar to voters. But local politics directly touches our daily lives and families. Who is making policies and how do we choose them? In New Hampshire, that can be a daunting process, thanks to the large citizen legislature. However, there are tools out there to help research the candidates and decide who meets your needs and priorities. On this episode of “The State We’re In,” Anna Brown, executive director of Citizens Count, a nonprofit and nonpartisan organization dedicated to educating voters about the political process, as well as executive director of the Warren B. Rudman Center for Justice, Leadership and Public Service at the University of New Hampshire’s Franklin Pierce School of Law, discusses these tools.

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

Melanie Plenda:

Anna, with elections on the horizon, can you tell us about some of the tools Citizens Count offers to voters?

Anna Brown:

There are 400 state representatives, which means there's roughly 900 candidates that are going to be on your ballot. So probably the tool we're best known for is our candidate profiles, where we provide background, issue positions, and so on. We offer other tools for voters as well.  If you look up your town, we can show your polling location and your clerk info. We have a section called “Prepare to Vote” under our advocacy toolkit that offers information about what to bring to the polls, registering, and absentee ballots. We also have other tutorials on what to do after the election. How do I contact an elected official? How do I advocate for my cause? Then finally, we also offer a candidate comparison tool that lets voters see, “OK just for the candidates on my ballot, where do they stand on certain issues?”

Melanie Plenda:

Why are these tools necessary?

Anna Brown:

I've been covering New Hampshire elections for a while now, and every single election I have seen there are races that come down to less than half a dozen votes. There are multiple recounts, and when you're talking about a recount in New Hampshire, it's literally paper ballots, the secretary of state's office inspecting them one by one, with observers in place. In the primaries, when there's a tie it’s not uncommon enough that they actually have official dice to help settle ties. 

So I always tell voters in New Hampshire that your vote counts. It isn't just a feel-good statement. There's all these candidates, roughly 900. It can be really hard to find information about those folks. Some of them don't have email addresses or websites, so that's where Citizens Count comes in, and we're trying to fill that gap. Because the other thing that's true, they don't always fall on party lines. In New Hampshire, you will find Democrats who are against gun laws. You will find Republicans who favor more lenient laws related to abortion than what is currently on the books. So I always encourage people to check out those individual candidates and don't just rely on the “D” or the
“R” next to someone's name.

Melanie Plenda:

How do you compile this information? Can you describe the process?

Anna Brown:

Our best tool is our candidate survey. We will contact them by email, snail mail, phone, follow up again for the folks that we can't find. I reach out to local parties and county parties sometimes, and we do get over half of candidates to respond to our survey. So most of our background information and issue positions are straight from their own mouth, and that's very important to us. We don't want to have any spin on our issue positions. 

Melanie Plenda:

How much work does that take to put all this together?

Anna Brown:

There's three of us full time, some part time, and every election we also get an elections intern. Shout out to our current elections intern, Anna Steele, who has been incredible this year. It is a lot of hounding candidates, a lot of phone calls, a lot of stuffing envelopes. We also really are trying to hold each other to that rigorous standard of staying nonpartisan and engaging with candidates. When candidates come back to us and they say, “I don't like how that question was worded, or it was biased, or I just want to submit a statement,” we want to work with them. If anybody ever comes to us, including many candidates, and says, “Where are you getting your money from? What is your real agenda? Who's on your board?” These are all questions that we want to be completely transparent about, and so we do a lot of engagement there as well.

Melanie Plenda:

There’s also a constitutional amendment on the ballot related to the ages of judges in the state. Can you tell us about that? 

Anna Brown: 

Many people may not know that the New Hampshire Constitution requires judges and sheriffs to retire at the age of 70. This is a huge contrast to the U.S. Supreme Court, where we have seen, on many occasions, people simply pass away before they retire, and it can have a huge impact on rulings. 

New Hampshire originally included this in the Constitution because they were concerned about the cognitive abilities, potentially, of judges and sheriffs. But that being said, when the Constitution was written, age expectancy was different. So now there is a proposal on the ballot, an amendment to our Constitution, that would raise the age of retirement to 75. This was actually sponsored by a member of the N.H. Supreme Court who was forced to retire at age 70 and is now serving in the House of Representatives. So that is going to be one of the questions on the ballot that you will see. It does require a super majority of voters, in order to change our Constitution. That's a kind of high threshold, but every now and then we do pass constitutional amendments. For example, in 2018 there was a new constitutional amendment that creates a right to privacy. If you do want to dig more into this, we do also have a link on our elections page, again, on https://www.citizenscount.org/ that includes a brief article on the pros and cons on that amendment.

Melanie Plenda:

Can you share a few of those pros and cons with this?

Anna Brown:

We do have some concern about what is going on with people as they are getting older. Is there perhaps some cognitive decline? That's a huge conversation that has happened with President Biden, with former President Trump, and it continues to this day. Another pro is that it actually ensures that you have sort of that fresh issue perspective coming onto the courts. So it's not so much as whether they're cognitively there, but also are they in tune with your average voter? Certainly, we know that demographics change based on what age group you're in, how you feel about certain issues. For example, we think about generational changes, things such as interracial marriage and gay marriage — there were sometimes very big gaps in terms of how younger people felt and how older people felt about the same issue. 

We also have that higher age that people are living, thriving, even working, and especially in New Hampshire we have one of the oldest states on average in the nation. And we're seeing folks who may be past traditional retirement age, say Social Security retirement age, who are still interested in working, are still vibrant, and indeed bring a lot of experience and knowledge to their jobs. The same thing is very much true for judges. The more experience you have on the bench, the more connections you have with lawyers and prosecutors and defenders, and so on. You might be able to have a more efficient court, a more knowledgeable court, as opposed to constantly bringing in new people and just giving up all of that knowledge and experience when there really isn't a reason to boot it out. I will say five years is not a huge change. We're not getting rid of the age limit entirely with this proposal. We're just saying, instead of 70 it’s 75. This also would not affect sheriffs, because there are some arguments, of course, that a law enforcement position is a little bit different. This part of the amendment would only impact the age limit for judges.

Melanie Plenda:

And, as awesome as Citizens Count is, there are also other ways to scope out the candidates. What do you recommend Anna?

Anna Brown:

Definitely, if you can find some local candidate events, parades, at town hall forums, public libraries, sometimes at your local school. There are going to be these events where the candidates are on hand. The audience is probably similar to what you might see at your town meeting. And they'll interact with you. You can get a really good sense of a person, what they'll be like as a legislator, if you have that conversation with them.

I talked about how we call a lot of these candidates and have conversations with them. The vast, vast majority are interested in engaging in that conversation. Because, realistically, these people are volunteers. They get paid $100 a year plus mileage. They're doing this because they are deeply passionate about it. Every now and then you are going to find someone who is contrary and doesn't like to talk to people. But in a House full of 400 representatives, there's always going to be that small margin. Overall, I have such positive experiences, and I hear that from other people too. However, if you're an introvert and you don't want to go out and talk to candidates, your local newspaper is often a wonderful resource in terms of finding these issue positions. They’ll do candidate profiles, have interviews. That's not something you're going to get from national news coverage, and that's one reason why local news sources are so important. You can also go directly to the candidate websites or other interest groups. Just be aware that how certain issue positions are phrased may be intended to lead you in a certain direction, or may be a little general. So if someone says, “I support veterans,” try to dig a little deeper and say, “What does that really mean?”

Melanie Plenda:

Anna Brown is the executive director of Citizens Count, a nonprofit and nonpartisan organization dedicated to educating voters about the political process. She is also the executive director of the Warren B. Rudman Center for Justice, Leadership, and Public Service at the University of New Hampshire’s Franklin Pierce School of Law. Thank you for joining us. 

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communications. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visit collaborativenh.org.

How the Civic Health Index sheds light on community trust and how to build it

The University of New Hampshire’s Carsey School of Public Policy released its 2024 Civic Health Index this month. The report examines several aspects of public life, including how much people trust each other and government institutions, attend public meetings, vote, and help their neighbors. On this episode of “The State We’re In,” Carsey School of Public Policy Interim Associate Director Michele Holt-Shannon and the report’s author, Quixada Moore-Vissing, founder of Public Engagement Partners discuss the findings.

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

Melanie Plenda:

Michele, can you tell us more about the background of the Civic Health Index? 

Michele Holt-Shannon:

A lot has happened — not just the pandemic, a lot of just increasing division in our country. We had the Jan. 6 incident at the Capitol building, the murder of George Floyd, the response to that, and certainly that experience of the pandemic that really varied for people across the country, depending on their job and where they lived. We had questions around connecting with neighbors, volunteering, helping each other, feeling like you matter and belong. So there's, there's some data to look at today and to discuss and help us think about what we can do in the future.

Melanie Plenda:

Quixada, how was the data gathered for this report and how long did it take? 

Quixada Moore-Vissing:

We really wanted to understand how the pandemic and these other events of 2020 actually impact civic health in New Hampshire. Did it impact civic health? That was one of our big questions. So we looked at both pre-pandemic data, pandemic-level data, and then post-pandemic-level data to just kind of see what the changes are. Are there impacts during this point in time?

We used two data sources for the report. One so is the U.S. Census, and it has a civic engagement and volunteering supplement and a voting supplement. We pulled from both of those census supplements, but we also ran our own survey through the Granite State Poll, and we had used the Granite State Poll in the past, so we were able to make some longitudinal comparisons there as well. 

Melanie Plenda:

What were some of the report’s key findings? 

Quixada Moore-Vissing:

One of the big things that we found that was a surprise is that New Hampshire residents are feeling they matter less to their communities than they did in 2019. In 2019, we were at 76% of New Hampshire residents felt like they matter to their communities, and that fell to 43%. That's a 30 percentage point decrease. 

Connected to that, we also learned that we're generally connecting a bit less with others than we were before the pandemic. New Hampshire residents who do favors for their neighbors, helping someone, loan a lawnmower, or move an air conditioner — that fell from 11% to 5%. In  terms of people working to do positive things for their community, that fell from 27% in 2019 to 21% in 2021. Granite Staters are also hearing from or spending less time with their family and friends, from 85% to 81% — that data point is all 2021 data. So it'll be interesting to see in the next census data pool, if some of that rebounds, or if it stays the same. 

Some of the other things we found are that New Hampshire residents are attending public meetings less, so that that fell from 19% in 2019 to 12% in 2021. We also found that New Hampshire residents have a slight majority engaging across race, ethnicity, or culture that's different from their own. So that was another finding. 

In terms of voting — which I know is everyone's top of mind right now with the election coming up — we found that in the 2020 election there was record voter turnout across the nation. New Hampshire mirrored that trend, both in 2020 and in the midterm elections. In 2022, we had surges in voter turnout. We were above the rest of the country in that, but we kind of sort of mirrored that national trend. But one of the concerning things we saw about voting is that urban residents actually were voting less than suburban or rural residents in that election. 76% of rural people voted, for instance, in the 2020 election, compared with 57% of urban residents. 

We never measured belonging before in New Hampshire. What we found, in general, is that about half of New Hampshire residents are feeling like they belong to their local communities, but about half are feeling that they don't. So 49% of New Hampshire residents share that they belong in their local community; 59% felt comfortable expressing their opinions in their local community. About 55% felt satisfied with their relationships with others in the local community, and 62% felt connected to their local community. So, it depends how you slice the cake, right?  We could see this as a positive that we've got slight majorities feeling like they belong, but you could also say that there's about 50% of people in a lot of these outcomes that aren't feeling like they belong. 

Then the last thing that I wanted to mention, which is a big one, is that our trust in government in New Hampshire has dropped significantly since 2001 — that's trust both in national and local government. The trust in the national government is a more severe plummet. In 2001, about 31% of New Hampshire residents felt trust in the national government. It's now down to 17%, but actually only 1% of New Hampshire residents trust the national government all of the time, and about 49% almost never, trust the national government. Trust from 2019 to 2024 in the national government stayed about the same. So it was low in 2019 and just kind of stayed low. 

Trust in local government also fell from 2001 so we saw it fall from 53% to 36%, and then it stayed about the same from 2019 to 2024. So, interestingly, we're not seeing huge drops in trust in government from pre- and post-pandemic, but we are just seeing a general decline in trusting in both national and local governments since 2001.

Melanie Plenda:

Let’s explore some of those findings a bit more. Michele. When residents say they matter less and engage less, what does that mean and why should we all be concerned about that? 

Michele Holt-Shannon:

The mattering question is compelling, because people interpret it and answer the question differently. I'll note that some of the folks watching this may be familiar with the Youth Risk Behavior Survey that's done in schools. One of the questions on that survey a few years ago was whether or not young people feel like they matter to their community. The question wasn't there for a couple of years, and it's back now. I think it is an interesting one to think about, because I have a reaction that I hope people feel like they matter. When that number is low, it is concerning, and it says something about the state of community, of connectedness — of civic health, broadly. I think it can be a red flag when mattering numbers are low, when fewer people feel like they matter to a community. So it's a way of giving us a chance to say, we want that number to be higher. We want that number to be higher for young people, we want that number to be higher for everyone — that people would feel like they can engage, share their opinions and influence the community where they live.

Melanie Plenda:

Quixada, trust in local and national government is at an all-time low. Why is that, and what does that mean for the community? 

Quixada Moore-Vissing:

One of the frustrations about survey research is, we ask a question, such as how much do you trust the government? How much do you trust the national government? How much do you trust the local government? And people pick an option. I trust the government a lot or I trust the government not so much. What we don't know is the story behind that. What is behind the lack or loss of trust? 

But I can make some guesses. I think the one thing that's going on with trust nationally is that we've become such a polarized country, and that polarization at the national level is trickling down to the state level and is trickling down to local communities and public meetings. The fact is that whoever is elected, whatever party, there will be some people who are alienated by that leadership simply because of the party identity and how they conceptualize that now. I do think it's possible for a Democratic leader to try to really be inclusive of a lot of Republican ideas or a Republican leader to be inclusive of a lot of Democratic ideas, especially at the local level, and really, really listen to those points of view. 

The other thing that I think has been really difficult for trust in government is the amount of misinformation that we have right now, where it's very hard to know what is truth and what is something that has been fictionalized to try to sort of influence people towards a certain policy outcome. I think that's a big reason why we need lots of media literacy in our K-12 education to try to help prepare the next generations of Americans to be able to sort of make those judgments based on facts. 

I think there’s also a lot that government can do, particularly at the local level to try to build up trust. I would say some local governments are pretty good at these things, and some local governments aren’t. These are things like just being transparent about your processes. How do you make decisions? Why did you make a decision? Being inclusive about your processes. Did you really hear from everybody in the community? Did you go out of your way to hold a meeting at a time that would work for folks who were at work, or different kinds of populations in the community? Then also demonstrating responsiveness and following through when there's lots of people in the community asking about something or expressing concerns. If you gather the community and ask for their opinion, you actually follow through and tell them how their opinions were used to make a decision. 

Melanie Plenda:

Michele, now that this report is completed, what happens next? How can this information be used? What needs further study? 

Michele Holt-Shannon:

We hope people will certainly read this report and think about how it applies to their own work and community. One of the things that we're thinking about is voting. It is top of mind right now with the election coming up, and we are curious about some of those patterns. Are there linkages in terms of mattering and voting, and are there linkages across political identity and voting, and certainly digging into that urban-rural-suburban connection. We work with schools and towns and government commissions and nonprofits and help them think about how more people and more organizations are trying to engage the public or engage people in their community. How can they do that in ways that build trust, that are authentic?

I think we also are looking forward to understanding, as New Hampshire's diversity grows, what are the ways that we can foster belonging across differences in lots of different ways — racial, political, economic, and so on. Are we living in very isolated groupings, and are there ways to foster people coming together across different groups that help people feel connected to their community and interacting with people who are different from themselves, which is something that is helpful for us to do.

We all have biases. We all have experiences that you know can be limiting, and then we don't know what we don't know. Until we meet other people.  So talking across politics, I will say, is one thing that it actually can help us feel better and more hopeful about the direction of the country. If we get into a place where we're not talking with people who vote differently than us, then if I do that for too long, I'm starting to make up stories about the people who vote differently from me, and I need to interact. And for me, those people are in my family, and so I especially want to interact and save those relationships. So I think there's lots to think about personally in reading this — like, what do I want to do more of? And then also, as someone who works with communities, how do we help communities engage authentically, foster trust and enfranchise their community members?

Melanie Plenda:

This question is for both of you — what is the major takeaway for New Hampshire residents about this report, and what do you advise them to do about it?

Quixada Moore-Vissing:

We’ve presented some research findings to viewers of this show, and I hope that you can take action. The point of doing these reports is to actually inform some interventions around civic health that you build and can move positive outcomes forward and in the state. So that would be one thing. 

The other, I would say, is I think a lot of us are feeling pretty powerless when we look at national democracy and civic health right now. There's a lot going on nationally, and it can feel like you can’t even make a difference with the complexity of what's happening. The fact is, it's going to be hard to impact national policy sitting from our homes in New Hampshire, but what we can do is act locally and try to strengthen civic health at the local level.

For some of you, this may be work that you take on through an organization that you work with, that you volunteer with, but this can also be very individual behavior. Small acts, like showing someone in your community that they matter to you who might not know that. Some other things that can be done is that institutions, like local government, public schools, nonprofits, can try to brainstorm, “What are three ways this year that we can build community trust, and let's do that as part of our strategic plan.” I really encourage that at every level. I hope that we can take action around civic health. I am an idealist, but I do believe that if a lot of people are influencing their direct spheres of reference, that it can be a ripple effect, and that change can happen. So I hope to see that positive change in New Hampshire.

Michele Holt-Shannon:

I have to double down on local because it's where most of us have a stronger tie. We have relationships locally that start to be more distant the further away they are geographically. That's a place where I think you can think small but still have a big outcome, you can go out and meet more of your neighbors or go join a group in the community. From an individual level to all the things that you can do at your job, your organization, and a community group that you're a part of — I think little things pay off.

Melanie Plenda:

Thank you for joining us, Carsey School of Public Policy Interim Associate Director Michele Holt-Shannon and report author and founder of Public Engagement Partners Quixada Moore-Vissing.

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communications. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visit collaborativenh.org.

How the ‘Counting the Vote’ special on PBS debunks concerns about the election process

On this episode of “The State We’re In,” Melanie Plenda talks with Margaret Hoover, host of PBS’s “Firing Line” about the show’s recent one-hour special, “Counting the Vote.”  It contains fascinating sections about election procedures and all things that, perhaps in the past, people didn't think about much, but today have become embroiled in controversy.

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity.

Melanie Plenda: 

When you were conceiving the special with your team, what went into it? What was it like putting this show together? 

Margaret Hoover:

I’m glad to help shine a light on what I think is ultimately one of the most important functions of democracy, which is how we administer a vote in a way that engenders confidence with the electorate. After 18 months of conceiving of this project and bringing it to air, I have concluded, and I hope viewers will conclude, that there is a very, very good case to be made that elections in the United States are safe, secure, transparent and trustworthy. They are not only those four things – they are the most safe, the most secure, the most transparent and the most trustworthy in the world by a lot, and probably in the course of human history. We have a lot to be confident about, but we also need to shine a light on how we do it, so that we can demystify and answer some of the conspiracy theories and doubts that circulate, so that people will have confidence in the integrity of our elections.

What went into it was simply traveling and talking to people and doing the research. We don't have one election for president in this country on Nov. 5, 2024. We have 50 state elections for electors, and those 50 states administer the elections in 10,000-plus jurisdictions across the country, and in a way that federalism really protects the security of our elections. There's no way to rig the presidential election in this country, which is a wonderful sort of innovation of the founding fathers that is embedded in the Constitution. Every state gets to choose how to administer its votes. What it also means is, when there are states that are incredibly close, one has to really understand how that state chooses to administer its elections. 

Melanie Plenda:

As you went through this process and conducted these interviews what surprised you?

Margaret Hoover:

One of the things that surprised me is that you hear as you evaluate — and we all hear some of the doubts and concerns that are circulated on the Internet amongst our friends and neighbors — one you hear frequently is, “Well, we should just all have paper ballots” because there's this concern or fear that some of the election machinery might be susceptible to being hacked or manipulated. People suggest that perhaps the algorithms can be changed, or we don't know what they are. Actually, as it turns out, about 98% of the ballots in the United States have a paper trail. In other words, you count on a machine, but there is an actual paper ballot correlated to each individual's vote. So we do have a way of checking. There is no way of hacking or manipulating the election machinery or the algorithms or the computers to change the votes because we have a process for hand-counting ballots in certain states just to ensure that they work. Also, many states implement automatic audits, where you audit the vote almost immediately following the vote itself, just to ensure the integrity of the vote. 

The other thing that was really wonderful to see, particularly in the battleground states we visited, but also in the states that are deep red — states like Utah, that administers 100% mail-in voting. The election boards love to have people come and watch. They have basically created facilities where journalists, media, civic groups — any kind of group — can come and visit and see how elections are administered. 

I really encourage anyone who has concern about how your local elections are administered to get in touch with your local election board and see if you can set up a visit or volunteer, because there is, first of all, a real dearth of people who are wanting to volunteer because there have been so many threats leveled at individuals who volunteer. These are volunteers in a service that is critically necessary for representative democracy, that depends on ensuring that we have a stable and confident vote amongst our people in order to secure our elected representatives. Go volunteer and take a look around, because those folks are doing really great work. They're fastidious in every single state about how they count the ballots, secure the ballots, process the ballots, and are doing really good work on behalf of all of us.

Melanie Plenda:

Which states do you think might face some challenges? 

Margaret Hoover:

The first time we saw real challenges to the counting in many, many states, which led to the challenging of accepting the slates of electors at the counting of the electoral ballots last Jan. 6, 2020. The states that were questioned last time are still of concern this time maybe perhaps with the exception of Michigan. But I think Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Arizona and Georgia are all states that are going to be very, very close, but they have done different things in each state to prepare. 

So Georgia, for example, passed an election law which actually led to more people voting in 2022 than had ever voted in the state of Georgia before. They've really done a number of things to increase the transparency, security, trustworthiness and integrity of the elections in Georgia. 

On the other hand, Pennsylvania we know will be very, very close. The legislature tried to consider several bills, but they just could never get anything passed in order to lock down any of these standards of election integrity or apply any of these new standards of election integrity.

You'll see in the film a very frustrated election commissioner from Philadelphia, who actually was the only Republican from Philadelphia Election Commission to stand up — well, not the only one, but one of the ones who stood up — and said, “In fact, I've counted and I've recounted and we've re-audited, and I can confirm that Joe Biden won Philadelphia and won Pennsylvania,” to much criticism, frankly, and direct threats by the Republican Party and Donald Trump. But still, Pennsylvania has not taken the steps it needs to pre-process ballots, and so it will take longer for them to process and get a result in Pennsylvania — in particular the Philadelphia area, because in Philadelphia, they cannot start opening ballots and counting ballots until 7 p.m. on Election Day.

Melanie Plenda:

We recently had state primaries for congressional districts and governor. New Hampshire officials have always talked about how secure our elections are — even before 2020, that was really a point of pride for our former secretary of state. What struck me when I listened to the most recent slate of candidates was the number of them who didn’t outright deny the election results, but said, “they had questions” or thought there were “irregularities.” What is the advantage for candidates to say this? You would think in some respects it would depress turnout because they are essentially saying the process might be rigged. What do you think the political calculus is there?

Margaret Hoover:

Well, there isn't a sensible one, honestly. Arizona is a great example actually, where people would say, “Maybe there were some uncertainties or problems in Arizona.” Except Republicans won all down the ballot in Arizona in 2020, but Donald Trump didn't win the state. What happened, as election officials and also former state representatives and electors in Arizona explained, is that many, many Republicans — as many as 12,000 — left the top of the ballot blank, didn't vote for Donald Trump and then voted for Republicans all down ballot. So it's hard if you're a Republican in Arizona to say there was election fraud because you got elected as a Republican, even though Donald Trump didn't. 

I say this as a Republican who has observed what has happened in the Republican Party and the realignment. There has been, I've observed, a shift in how we talk about elections. I think it's so important to shine a light on this issue because, for certain Republicans, it has become a litmus test to suggest there might be something untoward about elections, and if New Hampshire Republicans say the election was great in New Hampshire, it's just somewhere else that there might have been trouble they’re contributing to this sowing of doubt because we have audited elections in all four of the states that were challenged in for the Electoral College in 2020 on January 6. Those ballots have been counted and recounted. They have been audited. They have been viewed by outside groups. You can go look at all of the information and all of the theories, and that's why administration officials from the Trump administration, in the Department of Justice, in the Department of Homeland Security, in the Department of Defense have all said that 2020, was actually the most secure election in American history. 

This is about politics, not about how well we administer our elections, and I think as long as we can point that out to people and people can recognize or actually just ask themselves, if they're hearing some kind of uncertainty around the elections, is this a political point or is this actually about the transparency and the integrity of how my local elections are being administered? 

Because one of the other things that we see recently in the news is that many people believe that their state and their locality does a good job administering elections, but they worry about other states. I think that's another piece of this too, that transparency helps shine a light on how every state does this, and how we can improve the functioning of the election administration in each state. It's up to each state legislature and each secretary of state and governor to get that done in their state. But, I think, too often casting doubt on the integrity of our elections has become a political talking point on the right that actually undermines the public's confidence in our elections. 

Melanie Plenda:

What are you working on now for “Firing Line?” What’s coming up in the next few weeks? 

Margaret Hoover:

I think I can tease that we’re planning to have Gen. H.R. McMaster on the program in the coming weeks. I also plan to have some election administration officials on the program to talk about what has been happening in some of these key swing states that are likely to be states that we're talking about on election night and election week that take a little bit of time to vote. 

An election official from Arizona will be on along with an election official from Michigan, and a Republican election lawyer, will also be on. We're going to just spend some time making sure that the public is aware that we're probably not going to know the answer of who won the election on Nov. 5. It's going to take several days, maybe even a week or two, to ensure that all the ballots are counted, especially with the tragic and really cataclysmic storms that have hit Florida and North Carolina that will just inevitably slow down the process. We want to make sure we count every ballot and ensure that it is secure and transparent and trustworthy and fair.

Melanie Plenda:

Margaret Hoover, host of “Firing Line,” thank you so much for joining us. 

“The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communications. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members. These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visit collaborativenh.org.

Fostering civic engagement: New Hampshire's initiative to strengthen voter education

Pretty much everyone agrees — civic education is important. But why? And what exactly does that entail? On this episode of “The State We’re In,” New Hampshire Secretary of State David Scanlan and Lily Woo, the state’s Civic and Voter Education Coordinator talk about a new initiative to foster civic education in the state.

By Rosemary Ford and Caitlin Agnew

This article has been edited for length and clarity. 

Melanie Plenda:

First, let’s talk about civics. Secretary Scanlan, how would you define what that is and why it’s important? 

David Scanlan:

Well, civics is a basic understanding of our government, and from my perspective, state government is just very, very important. Every citizen of New Hampshire has the opportunity to participate in their government, and they do that through their right to vote, and if they are a registered voter, then they also have the right to run for office. That process is integral, integral to our society and the way that it operates. So it is really, really important that that system function very, very well.

Melanie Plenda:

Tell us about the role of the civic and voter education coordinator and what you hope comes from it. 

David Scanlan:

In my experience in government, which has spanned over several decades in a number of different areas, there just seems to be a general decline in confidence that voters have when they go to the voting booths. Along with that comes a lot of misinformation and disinformation that is out there flowing around, and it is becoming more and more prevalent through the use of social media and the sophisticated and technical ways that we have to communicate today, as opposed to the way we communicated 20 years ago. That coincides with a decline in the knowledge that voters have about how their electoral system works.

While I have spent a lot of time over the last 20 years helping to educate poll workers and individuals that are engaged in the actual process of conducting elections, I find now that it is really important that we reach out to voters and educate in those processes as well. 

Most voters, when they go to their polling place, they check in, they receive a ballot, they mark the ballot, and they turn it into the moderator, and then they leave the polling place. What they may not be aware of when they go through that process is the many checks and balances that are built into our system that help guarantee and make sure that their votes are accurately counted and that the process is working properly. We have to take the time to help our voters understand that, and the way we do it is to be more transparent and educate the voting public — not only when they go through the polling place, but at every opportunity that we have when they engage in their civic government. 

So that's why I believe it's important that we have this position now of civics and voter education outreach coordinator, so that we can be proactive in reaching out to students and groups and everyday citizens about how our governmental system works, and why it is important that they understand that process and participate in it.

Melanie Plenda:

Lily, I'd love to know how you are finding the role, and tell us more about what you've been up to.

Lily Woo:

First of all, not having a blueprint has been a bit challenging. I think the atmosphere is very fraught right now with misinformation, disinformation, and that is challenging. But I think with all of these challenges, there comes excitement for the opportunity to be part of a team that works hard to be proactive and that combats the misinformation, the disinformation.

I think, as a former teacher, it's ironic to me that we teach our students to hand in work that is theirs. We teach our students to do the right thing when nobody's watching. So the excitement of this position is to be part of a team that combats the misinformation, the disinformation and the artificial intelligence that's out there. I think that's pretty common with challenges and opportunities. 

One of the things that I really enjoyed was being part of the election training and talking to the election officials out there and hearing from them what they're seeing in the public, and eventually putting together a curriculum that will address the issues that the election officials are bringing up.

Melanie Plenda:

What are they seeing in the public? What are the issues?

Lily Woo:

They are issues that can be as foundational as, what do you need to register to vote? I think there can be issues that are more complex, like, what are you allowed to wear in a polling station to, when can I change my party affiliation? There's a primary election, there's a general election, and the rules are different — or at least to a certain extent — not vastly different, but there are things that are different. So I think there are issues that certainly we can help to educate the public on that will help election officials be able to concentrate on having a polling station that is run efficiently and eliminate all of those layers of having to repeat the answer to the same questions.

Melanie Plenda:

Lily, you mentioned the curriculum. What are your goals for developing a curriculum about civics? 

Lily Woo:

Anytime you develop a curriculum, you always have to begin with the end in mind. In this case, you begin with an end in mind of two pillars. The one pillar being the foundational elements of civics, which is individual rights, the rights guaranteed in the Constitution, the rights guaranteed in the Bill of Rights. The other pillar is civic responsibility. 

So if you begin with that end in mind, the other piece you need is the why. If you can get to the foundational elements of “what does it mean to be a citizen with individual rights?” you can start to give students the tools to combat the misinformation, the disinformation. If you can give students a sound relation to what it means to be civically responsible. Well, then you give them a tool to be good citizens in society, and then ultimately that's going to hopefully build trust in foundational systems that have been the bedrock of communities and this country.

Melanie Plenda:

This question is for both of you. How will this help educators? Lily, let's start with you.

Lily Woo:

Being an educator myself, I think it's not just about handing the school a curriculum and saying, “have at it.” I think there are a lot of factors that go into being in front of a body of students, whether it's 15, 25, 35. So I think knowing classroom teachers have a resource here, knowing that I understand what it is like to be in a classroom, I hope is helpful to educators.

David Scanlan:

This is really a multi-stage program, and the curriculum part of it is the long-term planning. How do we get a program, a solid program, that school districts can use around the state to teach students in the classroom? But beyond that, there are other groups out there that are important to this process, and it’s important that we reach out to them as well.

So we have some initiatives going where we've been working with veterans’ groups to try and get out and communicate with veterans.They already know about civics because they have sacrificed for our country in different ways, and we want to pull from that experience that they've had and the respect that they have in their own communities and try and engage them to become participants in the election process in terms of helping at polls and other things.

We had a great “I Voted” sticker contest that was in the school system. That's something that we can continue as a program. That's kind of a short-term initiative, but it generates tremendous interest and gets students engaged at a very early level. There may be other things that we can do, like essay contests in the higher grades. There are some awards that we can issue that are sponsored by national organizations, like the National Association of Secretaries of State, to young adults — whether they're high school seniors or college students or even slightly beyond that — to recognize individuals for their efforts in the community that have engaged in a civic way. 

Melanie Plenda:

That leads to our next question for the both of you: How will this help students and/or the general public?

David Scanlan:

The idea is just to help students and the general public understand things about the election process that they might not know. And if they do know, we'll give them confidence that we have a great system in New Hampshire, and that because of that, you should have confidence in the results of the elections. And to let them know that the opportunity is certainly there for them to become active participants in that process, so they can see firsthand and experience firsthand how these systems work and understand the checks and balances that are at play.

If we can encourage adults and voters to do that, then I think the misinformation part is going to take care of itself. When people become aware and knowledgeable, it is less easy to fall victim to incorrect facts out there about the election process itself. 

Lily Woo:

One of the things that I know about this office, and I know the secretary is very keyed in on, is recognizing and acknowledging when students or when the public is engaged in the civic process. If we can continue building the foundation for students and creating civically literate graduates who enter into this world, hopefully that spirit of engagement will continue and will carry on for a lifetime — whether it is volunteering at the polls on Election Day or whether it is continuing to look out for neighbors, be part of the community, that everyone's moving in the same direction toward the public good. When everybody's rowing in the same direction, good things are going to happen.

Melanie Plenda:

Here’s another question for the both of you: As we approach the election, what would you like people to know about the process as it stands right now? 

David Scanlan:

Well, New Hampshire has a unique system in terms of its elections, and what makes it unique is the fact that we elect our local election officials at the local level, so people's neighbors, their peers, family and friends, are actually the ones that are running the election — the polling place that voters will go to in that community. Those individuals are elected because people have faith in their ability, they believe in their integrity and their honesty, and that goes a long way in giving them some confidence. 

We have a very human process too, and errors can be made. I mean, people can make an error in adding numbers together when they're reporting final results, but our system is built to withstand that because it is easy to request a recount in the state. We now perform audits of ballot counting devices and things like that. So while the system was not designed to be perfect, it was built to accurately reflect who won an election when the dust settles, and New Hampshire does a great job. 

I mentioned that there are checks and balances at play in the polling place, and some of those involve the political parties themselves. They are allowed to make appointments of participants in the polling place, and the best example of that are the inspectors of election, which are more commonly known as the ballot clerks. Those individuals are the ones that hand a ballot to the voter when they're checking in, while the other individual crosses the name of the voter off the checklist. That's usually a Republican and a Democrat sitting side by side, engaging in that process. So not only can they keep an eye on each other, but they can also see what is going on in the polling place itself — and it's those checks and balances that are really important to just making sure that the system works properly. 

At the end of the night, when the moderator announces the results, the ballots are all packaged up and placed in boxes with security tape. There's a seal that is placed over those boxes that has to be signed by the selectmen in the town, and those seals are not broken unless there is a request for a recount or a court orders a ballot box be opened up for some reason. So those are the things that we need voters to understand and become aware of, and that's part of the importance of the program that Lily is engaging in right now. 

It’s also important for voters to understand the three different branches of government and the role that each plays in the process of elections. That's something that people are becoming less and less knowledgeable about, and it's time that we reverse that trend and make sure that people understand that the judicial branch of government, the executive branch of government and the legislative branch of government all have really important roles to play in our democratic process.

Lily Woo:

Having gone with the election trainers from this office and meeting with the election officials in the different towns across the state, what I would want the public to know is, as the secretary said, these people are your friends and your neighbors, and they are the ones that are making the process as efficient and as comfortable as possible for everyone. I think the public needs to know that.

As somebody said to me in one of the training sessions, “New Hampshire is working hard to do it right.” I think that is something that is a credit to the office here that is training the officials. I think it's a credit to the election officials, and I think it's a credit to the patience of the public — that if something is not going right at the polls, well, it's time to find the moderator and to ask the moderator questions about what is going on. But I think, as the secretary said, there are checks and balances built into the process. I think certainly voters should go in confident that New Hampshire is getting it right.

Melanie Plenda:

Well, you two have a lot on your plate, especially in the coming weeks. Good luck with these endeavors. Thank you for joining us, Secretary of State David Scanlan and Lily Woo, the state’s civic and voter education coordinator

These articles are being shared by partners in the Granite State News Collaborative. For more information, visitcollaborativenh.org. “The State We’re In” is a weekly digital public affairs show produced by NH PBS and The Marlin Fitzwater Center for Communications. It is shared with partners in the Granite State News Collaborative, of which both organizations are members.